market selloff

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madhatter
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Re: market selloff

Post by madhatter »

XtremeJibber2001 wrote:
madhatter wrote:brexit, polls fixed, outcome denied...

Britain votes to leave EU, Cameron quits as markets dive

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-brita ... SKCN0Z902K" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
US politicians take note.

My $.02. The EU gov't, much like the US gov't, spends a significant amount of time governing for the minority. The majority sits on the sidelines quiet as the impact to their way of life is only minimally impacted. That is, until they get tired of a government governing primarily for the minority and it begins to impact their way of life. Then they speak up, punished politicians, and take power back into their grasps. I think Brexit is the majority speaking up and out about an EU and UK leadership that governs as if London is the UK ... much like the US gov't governs as if the minority is the majority.
worth way more than .02 XJ...all the late polls had them staying by a large majority, nothing but wishful thinking but if you can sway just a few to the supposed "winning" side you can sway the vote... didn't work this time though...

Trump 2016
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Re: market selloff

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freeski
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Re: market selloff

Post by freeski »

This is the best day since the Patriots won the Super Bowel :!: The paper loses will soon be gained back. I remember when the EU started. I was in the room when the first Euro trade was executed in the U.S. Didn't realize how much of a disaster the EU would become.
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madhatter
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Re: market selloff

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Image
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Re: market selloff

Post by freeski »

Article, meh... The comments show the division on the issues in the UK and Europe. Yes, it's all about immigration. https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/1340224/c ... no-chance/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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madhatter
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Re: market selloff

Post by madhatter »

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-06-2 ... referendum" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Image
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madhatter
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Re: market selloff

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http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-08-0 ... nce-august" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
When Bloomberg reported late last year that China founded a working group to explore the use of the supranational Special Drawing Rights (SDR) currency, nobody took heed.
Caixin now confirmed which organization exactly will issue the bonds and when: The World Bank and the China Development Bank will issue private sector or “M” SDR in August.

The so-called SDR are an IMF construct of actual currencies, right now the euro, yen, dollar, and pound. It made news last year when the Chinese renminbi was also admitted, although it won’t formally be part of the basket until October 1st of this year.

How much? Nikkei Asian Review reports the volume will be between $300 and $800 million and some Japanese banks are interested in taking up a stake. According to Nikkei some other Chinese banks are also planning to issue SDR bonds. One of them could be the Industrial and Commercial Bank of China (ICBC) according to Chinese website Yicai.com.

The IMF experimented with these M-SDRs in the 1970s and 1980s when banks had SDR 5-7 billion in deposits and companies had issued SDR 563 million in bonds. A paltry amount, but the concept worked in practice.

The G20 finance ministers confirmed they will push this issue, despite private sector reluctance to use these instruments. In their communiqué released after their meeting in China on July 24:

“We support examination of the broader use of the SDR, such as broader publication of accounts and statistics in the SDR and the potential issuance of SDR-denominated bonds, as a way to enhance resilience [of the financial system].”

They are following the advice of governor of the People’s Bank of China (PBOC), Zhou Xiaochuan, although a bit late. Already in 2009 he called for nothing less than a new world reserve currency.

“Special consideration should be given to giving the SDR a greater role. The SDR has the features and potential to act as a super-sovereign reserve currency,” wrote Zhou.

Seven years later, it looks like he wasn’t joking.
nahhhhhhhh, never happen.... they won;t even let china near the IMF.... :roll: slowly but surely chipping away at the stone...
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Re: market selloff

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In Historic Event, China Sells First World Bank SDR-Denominated Bonds In Decades
In one of the most closely followed bond issues in recent history, overnight the International Bank for Reconstruction and Development (IBRD), one of the five member-institutions of the World Bank Group, sold 500 million SDR-denominated three-year bonds carrying a coupon of 0.49% at an auction in China's interbank market on Wednesday. This was the first SDR denominated offering in over three decades, with the issuance symbolically taking place in Shanghai one month before the official inclusion of China's currency in the SDR basket.

The issue, the first SDR bond in 35 years, is being closely watched by investors as it's part of a wider push in China to increase the net supply of such bonds, and comes as Beijing hosts the G20 summit in Hangzhou on Sept. 4-5. The SDR is a synthetic reserve currency administered by the IMF, whose value is determined by a basket of other major world currencies.

While some have speculated that the offering is a test toward internationalizing the SDR as a global reserve currency and putting the IMF at the forefront of a post-globalized world, with notable implications for the fate of the US Dollar as the global reserve, for now the consequences are more mundane: the SDR bonds that settle in RMB give Chinese domestic investors the option of getting exposure to different currency assets without investing overseas, says Ju Wang, a senior FX strategist at HSBC. According to PBOC deputy governor Pan Gongsheng the issuance of the SDR-denominated bond will help boost the stability of the international currency system. Pan said the SDR bonds will help investors avoid exchange-rate risks and are a good way of making the reserve currency a more a market-oriented pricing tool. The PBOC will work with IMF to further expand the use of the SDR, he said.

The first issuance in China of bonds denominated in Special Drawing Rights was well received, Gongsheng added, as he pledged to expand the use of the International Monetary Fund's reserve currency. Speaking at a press conference, Pan, who is also head of China's foreign exchange regulator, said the bid to cover ratio was 2.5 with around 50 institutional investors bidding for the bonds, including domestic banks, brokerages, insurance companies and overseas central banks as well as international organizations and overseas financial institutions. Chinese government bond auctions typically have a bid to cover ratio of around 3.

The bonds, which will be settled in yuan, were the first batch of a planned 2 billion SDR issue that the IBRD has won approval to sell in the interbank market.

The global lender has got approval from the PBOC for a 2 billion SDR programme, and despite the apparent success of Wednesday's issue analysts say future demand for the bonds from local investors might prove tepid.

"We are not interested in SDR bonds and we can't see why Chinese investors should want these bonds since they can easily buy much higher yielding bonds in China," said a fixed-income fund manager in Hong Kong who invests both onshore and offshore debt markets.

Analysts say China will be keen to foster interest in the SDR debt programme as it steps up efforts to internationalise the Chinese yuan, and further liberalise its capital markets.

While the SDR issuance may lead to greater global adoption of the Chinese currency as an initial step, the Yuan will remain a risky currency from the perspective of investors despite its inclusion in IMF’s basket of reserve currencies, Market News International reports, citing Guan Tao, a former SAFE official. “The yuan is a peripheral currency and a risky currency, not a safe-haven currency,” Guan is cited as saying in an interview.

Others were more optimistic, with HSBC saying the issuance will provide diversification in domestic investments for foreign investors who are accessing the Chinese market, but still buying government bonds or policy bank notes, Candy Ho, global head of RMB business development for global markets, says at a press conference today. HSBC expects potential pickup in interbank bond market activity following the Special Drawings Rights issuance, while the SDR issuance and RMB inclusion into SDR will bring inflows from central banks and other foreign institutions.

As to the fate of the SDR - or the Yuan - as a global exchange currency, the jury is still out.
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Re: market selloff

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Interesting piece of info mentioned on CNBC this morning. Dow was at 1000 or so in early January 1982 and is now at approximately 20,000. That prompted me to take a look at the S&P 500 and the price of gold in the same time period. The S&P was around 120 and gold was roughly $380 per ounce. Stocks pay dividends on top of their price valuation while gold collects dust. Regardless of the ups and downs of the stock market, it continues to be the better long term investment. Thoughts?
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madhatter
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Re: market selloff

Post by madhatter »

Bubba wrote:Interesting piece of info mentioned on CNBC this morning. Dow was at 1000 or so in early January 1982 and is now at approximately 20,000. That prompted me to take a look at the S&P 500 and the price of gold in the same time period. The S&P was around 120 and gold was roughly $380 per ounce. Stocks pay dividends on top of their price valuation while gold collects dust. Regardless of the ups and downs of the stock market, it continues to be the better long term investment. Thoughts?
metals are a hedge not an investment...
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Re: market selloff

Post by Guy in Shorts »

madhatter wrote:
Bubba wrote:Interesting piece of info mentioned on CNBC this morning. Dow was at 1000 or so in early January 1982 and is now at approximately 20,000. That prompted me to take a look at the S&P 500 and the price of gold in the same time period. The S&P was around 120 and gold was roughly $380 per ounce. Stocks pay dividends on top of their price valuation while gold collects dust. Regardless of the ups and downs of the stock market, it continues to be the better long term investment. Thoughts?
metals are a hedge not an investment...
Committed at 81% to the market/ 19% fixed. I'm bullish.
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Re: market selloff

Post by Bubba »

madhatter wrote:
Bubba wrote:Interesting piece of info mentioned on CNBC this morning. Dow was at 1000 or so in early January 1982 and is now at approximately 20,000. That prompted me to take a look at the S&P 500 and the price of gold in the same time period. The S&P was around 120 and gold was roughly $380 per ounce. Stocks pay dividends on top of their price valuation while gold collects dust. Regardless of the ups and downs of the stock market, it continues to be the better long term investment. Thoughts?
metals are a hedge not an investment...
Hedging is risk management. By buying gold/silver, what risk are you trying to manage?
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madhatter
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Re: market selloff

Post by madhatter »

Bubba wrote:
madhatter wrote:
Bubba wrote:Interesting piece of info mentioned on CNBC this morning. Dow was at 1000 or so in early January 1982 and is now at approximately 20,000. That prompted me to take a look at the S&P 500 and the price of gold in the same time period. The S&P was around 120 and gold was roughly $380 per ounce. Stocks pay dividends on top of their price valuation while gold collects dust. Regardless of the ups and downs of the stock market, it continues to be the better long term investment. Thoughts?
metals are a hedge not an investment...
Hedging is risk management. By buying gold/silver, what risk are you trying to manage?
bankruptcy, loss of assets, erosion of value, huge market crash, runaway inflation, currency devaluation, loss of USD as world reserve currency, cyber collapse of banking industry, loss of income, permanent disability, outliving my "other" retirement savings etc...basically vs catastrophic losses w the goal being to "have enough" in reserve to start over / cover my current debt if I had to...I have no kids so if I'm lucky enough to live long enough ( and strong enough) to justify liquidating assets including metal reserves to spend freely during those golden years that will simply be a bonus...right now it's serving me better than the countless dollars I spent drinking at the beach in my younger days...like GIS the percentage of assets allocated is small...one piece of a diverse package...


just a what if: what if there were a cyber attack that supposedly made banking records unverifiable? a massive market crash virtually annihilated boomers savings? ( or some other national or global economic meltdown?) how many would opt for a govt "cushion" or reimbursement for cents on the dollar vs absolute zero? what say would any of us have? anything digital can vaporize w/o a trace...like the hilldogs emails ( and her presidential aspirations)...
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XtremeJibber2001
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Re: market selloff

Post by XtremeJibber2001 »

madhatter wrote:just a what if: what if there were a cyber attack that supposedly made banking records unverifiable? a massive market crash virtually annihilated boomers savings? ( or some other national or global economic meltdown?) how many would opt for a govt "cushion" or reimbursement for cents on the dollar vs absolute zero? what say would any of us have? anything digital can vaporize w/o a trace...like the hilldogs emails ( and her presidential aspirations)...
I'll give Bubba an opportunity to respond to your what if, but Hillary's e-mail and banking records is like comparing apples to automobiles. Banks must be compliant with FBR controls as well as a myriad of other controls enforced by the OCC and other groups. These controls are reviewed and tested at least annually, if not more frequently. The problem with Hillary's e-mail is there was no enforcement with NIST and other frameworks to ensure she was compliant.

My $.02 ... those e-mails are out there. If they're not then there was a deliberate attempt to obstruct of evidence.
madhatter
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Re: market selloff

Post by madhatter »

XtremeJibber2001 wrote:
madhatter wrote:just a what if: what if there were a cyber attack that supposedly made banking records unverifiable? a massive market crash virtually annihilated boomers savings? ( or some other national or global economic meltdown?) how many would opt for a govt "cushion" or reimbursement for cents on the dollar vs absolute zero? what say would any of us have? anything digital can vaporize w/o a trace...like the hilldogs emails ( and her presidential aspirations)...
I'll give Bubba an opportunity to respond to your what if, but Hillary's e-mail and banking records is like comparing apples to automobiles. Banks must be compliant with FBR controls as well as a myriad of other controls enforced by the OCC and other groups. These controls are reviewed and tested at least annually, if not more frequently. The problem with Hillary's e-mail is there was no enforcement with NIST and other frameworks to ensure she was compliant.

My $.02 ... those e-mails are out there. but just like your bank records if no one is willing to "find" them ya got nuttin... If they're not then there was a deliberate attempt which prevents you from suffering a loss how?to obstruct of evidence.
EMP? stuxnet? previously unknown method?...nothing is infallible nor immune from corruption...plenty of ways for "digital credits" to disappear w/ no recourse...one of the zillion things I am trying to hedge against...I'm not seeing why so many insist upon attacking a position of diversity...same boring conversation over and over again...
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