IRS scandale will be the downfall of the Obama Administratio

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Bubba
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Re: IRS scandale will be the downfall of the Obama Administr

Post by Bubba »

Mister Moose wrote:
Bubba wrote:Although I can at least suspect a connection to the White House, it would be hard for me (at this time) to connect the dots all the way to the President. Remember, it took John Dean's testimony to make that case plus the Oval Office tapes to back him up. I really don't think you're going to find that kind of evidence this time around. Without that, you may find some staff people involved but that's where it will probably end, if it even gets that far.
That's what an investigation is for, to investigate. To find stuff out. We don't know what will be found, or what emails or John Deans might come out of the woodwork. I just know I'd like to know more than we do now.

And this 'dog ate my homework' lame excuse from the IRS makes me want to shine a very bright light on all those that are involved in it. Public trust should mean something.
Agreed, thus my parenthetical "at this time". This smells rotten and its connection to IRS leadership and beyond must be found out with anyone involved charged. This is positively "Nixonian" in its potential.
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XtremeJibber2001
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Re: IRS scandale will be the downfall of the Obama Administr

Post by XtremeJibber2001 »

Bubba wrote:
XtremeJibber2001 wrote:
Bubba wrote:Although I can at least suspect a connection to the White House, it would be hard for me (at this time) to connect the dots all the way to the President. Remember, it took John Dean's testimony to make that case plus the Oval Office tapes to back him up. I really don't think you're going to find that kind of evidence this time around. Without that, you may find some staff people involved but that's where it will probably end, if it even gets that far.
You think they would go through all this, possibly purger themselves, to protect some staffers?
Who is "they"?
It takes a lot more than a few staffers and Lerner to make e-mails disappear. I assume back-ups are kept in a secured facility and both physical/system level access is restricted to authorized personnel. I assume they also have a tape rotation to a hot/cold site for storage, which also has the same security precautions as the aforementioned data center.

Have you ever visit a facility housing sensitive gov't data? To make these e-mails disappear would require people of a significant rank within the gov't - certainly beyond what we might consider "staffer".
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Re: IRS scandale will be the downfall of the Obama Administr

Post by Bubba »

XtremeJibber2001 wrote:
Bubba wrote:
XtremeJibber2001 wrote:
Bubba wrote:Although I can at least suspect a connection to the White House, it would be hard for me (at this time) to connect the dots all the way to the President. Remember, it took John Dean's testimony to make that case plus the Oval Office tapes to back him up. I really don't think you're going to find that kind of evidence this time around. Without that, you may find some staff people involved but that's where it will probably end, if it even gets that far.
You think they would go through all this, possibly purger themselves, to protect some staffers?
Who is "they"?
It takes a lot more than a few staffers and Lerner to make e-mails disappear. I assume back-ups are kept in a secured facility and both physical/system level access is restricted to authorized personnel. I assume they also have a tape rotation to a hot/cold site for storage, which also has the same security precautions as the aforementioned data center.

Have you ever visit a facility housing sensitive gov't data? To make these e-mails disappear would require people of a significant rank within the gov't - certainly beyond what we might consider "staffer".

So my question again to you is who is the "they" in your statement "You think they would go through all this, possibly purger themselves, to protect some staffers?" If you don't know specifically, at least what part of the government is "they"?
"Abandon hope all ye who enter here"

Killington Zone
You can checkout any time you like,
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"The test of a first-rate intelligence is the ability to hold two opposed ideas in mind at the same time and still retain the ability to function" =
F. Scott Fitzgerald

"There's nothing more frightening than ignorance in action" - Johann Wolfgang von Goethe
XtremeJibber2001
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Re: IRS scandale will be the downfall of the Obama Administr

Post by XtremeJibber2001 »

Bubba wrote:
XtremeJibber2001 wrote:
Bubba wrote:
XtremeJibber2001 wrote:
Bubba wrote:Although I can at least suspect a connection to the White House, it would be hard for me (at this time) to connect the dots all the way to the President. Remember, it took John Dean's testimony to make that case plus the Oval Office tapes to back him up. I really don't think you're going to find that kind of evidence this time around. Without that, you may find some staff people involved but that's where it will probably end, if it even gets that far.
You think they would go through all this, possibly purger themselves, to protect some staffers?
Who is "they"?
It takes a lot more than a few staffers and Lerner to make e-mails disappear. I assume back-ups are kept in a secured facility and both physical/system level access is restricted to authorized personnel. I assume they also have a tape rotation to a hot/cold site for storage, which also has the same security precautions as the aforementioned data center.

Have you ever visit a facility housing sensitive gov't data? To make these e-mails disappear would require people of a significant rank within the gov't - certainly beyond what we might consider "staffer".

So my question again to you is who is the "they" in your statement "You think they would go through all this, possibly purger themselves, to protect some staffers?" If you don't know specifically, at least what part of the government is "they"?
The Executive branch.
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Re: IRS scandale will be the downfall of the Obama Administr

Post by Bubba »

XtremeJibber2001 wrote:
The Executive branch.
And the Executive Branch includes hundreds of people, from the Chief of Staff on down, which was exactly my point. We don't know that this goes into the White House, although we suspect that it does. It's an even bigger leap to connect it to Obama directly.
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Re: IRS scandale will be the downfall of the Obama Administr

Post by madhatter »

Feds admit Lerner email backups exist

http://www.caintv.com/feds-admit-lerner-email-backup" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

no way? they back up data? can;t believe no one thought of this before.... :roll:
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Re: IRS scandale will be the downfall of the Obama Administr

Post by freeski »

madhatter wrote:Feds admit Lerner email backups exist

http://www.caintv.com/feds-admit-lerner-email-backup" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

no way? they back up data? can;t believe no one thought of this before.... :roll:
There must be something in these emails that leads to the Whitehouse. If not why would they make themselves look like they are hiding something instead of disclosing the information? This doesn't do much for confidence in the government. I guess you could say that about most things this administration does. :-x
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madhatter
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Re: IRS scandale will be the downfall of the Obama Administr

Post by madhatter »

freeski wrote:
madhatter wrote:Feds admit Lerner email backups exist

http://www.caintv.com/feds-admit-lerner-email-backup" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

no way? they back up data? can;t believe no one thought of this before.... :roll:
There must be something in these emails that leads to the Whitehouse. If not why would they make themselves look like they are hiding something instead of disclosing the information? This doesn't do much for confidence in the government. I guess you could say that about most things this administration does. :-x
or doesn;t in this case....

http://www.caintv.com/foley-rescue-plan-was-ready-bu" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: IRS scandale will be the downfall of the Obama Administr

Post by XtremeJibber2001 »

madhatter wrote:
freeski wrote:
madhatter wrote:Feds admit Lerner email backups exist

http://www.caintv.com/feds-admit-lerner-email-backup" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

no way? they back up data? can;t believe no one thought of this before.... :roll:
There must be something in these emails that leads to the Whitehouse. If not why would they make themselves look like they are hiding something instead of disclosing the information? This doesn't do much for confidence in the government. I guess you could say that about most things this administration does. :-x
or doesn;t in this case....

http://www.caintv.com/foley-rescue-plan-was-ready-bu" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
No issue with this. There are always good reasons to delay when you're putting lives at risk. Look how many times the Osama raid was delayed - was the delay detrimental to the operation or did it save lives? We'll never know.
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Re: IRS scandale will be the downfall of the Obama Administr

Post by madhatter »

XtremeJibber2001 wrote:
madhatter wrote:
freeski wrote:
madhatter wrote:Feds admit Lerner email backups exist

http://www.caintv.com/feds-admit-lerner-email-backup" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

no way? they back up data? can;t believe no one thought of this before.... :roll:
There must be something in these emails that leads to the Whitehouse. If not why would they make themselves look like they are hiding something instead of disclosing the information? This doesn't do much for confidence in the government. I guess you could say that about most things this administration does. :-x
or doesn;t in this case....

http://www.caintv.com/foley-rescue-plan-was-ready-bu" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
No issue with this. There are always good reasons to delay when you're putting lives at risk. Look how many times the Osama raid was delayed - was the delay detrimental to the operation or did it save lives? We'll never know.
didn't save foley, as is the usual case the politics seem to take precedence...



Pentagon sources said Foley and the others might well have been rescued but Obama, concerned about the ramifications of US troops being killed or captured in Syria, took too long to authorise the mission.

Anthony Shaffer, a former lieutenant-colonel in US military intelligence who worked on covert operations, said: “I’m told it was almost a 30-day delay from when they said they wanted to go to when he finally gave the green light. They were ready to go in June to grab the guy [Foley] and they weren’t permitted.”

Another US defence source said: "The White House constantly goes back and forth on these things. These people are a bunch of academics who endlessly analyse stuff and ordering up another deep-thinking paper but can't decide what to order for lunch."
mach es sehr schnell

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Re: IRS scandale will be the downfall of the Obama Administr

Post by Bubba »

madhatter wrote:
XtremeJibber2001 wrote:
madhatter wrote:
freeski wrote:
madhatter wrote:Feds admit Lerner email backups exist

http://www.caintv.com/feds-admit-lerner-email-backup" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

no way? they back up data? can;t believe no one thought of this before.... :roll:
There must be something in these emails that leads to the Whitehouse. If not why would they make themselves look like they are hiding something instead of disclosing the information? This doesn't do much for confidence in the government. I guess you could say that about most things this administration does. :-x
or doesn;t in this case....

http://www.caintv.com/foley-rescue-plan-was-ready-bu" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
No issue with this. There are always good reasons to delay when you're putting lives at risk. Look how many times the Osama raid was delayed - was the delay detrimental to the operation or did it save lives? We'll never know.
didn't save foley, as is the usual case the politics seem to take precedence...



Pentagon sources said Foley and the others might well have been rescued but Obama, concerned about the ramifications of US troops being killed or captured in Syria, took too long to authorise the mission.

Anthony Shaffer, a former lieutenant-colonel in US military intelligence who worked on covert operations, said: “I’m told it was almost a 30-day delay from when they said they wanted to go to when he finally gave the green light. They were ready to go in June to grab the guy [Foley] and they weren’t permitted.”

Another US defence source said: "The White House constantly goes back and forth on these things. These people are a bunch of academics who endlessly analyse stuff and ordering up another deep-thinking paper but can't decide what to order for lunch."
If you go back to the Bay of Pigs invasion, you'll understand the reluctance to simply go with the intelligence and military without thinking things through from every different angle. It's a lesson all presidents following JFK have learned, sometimes the hard way.
"Abandon hope all ye who enter here"

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"The test of a first-rate intelligence is the ability to hold two opposed ideas in mind at the same time and still retain the ability to function" =
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madhatter
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Re: IRS scandale will be the downfall of the Obama Administr

Post by madhatter »

Bubba wrote:If you go back to the Bay of Pigs invasion, you'll understand the reluctance to simply go with the intelligence and military without thinking things through from every different angle. It's a lesson all presidents following JFK have learned, sometimes the hard way

anything is possible I suppose, but it certainly seems like politics play the front roll in these decisions too often...especially w this administration, always leading from behind, waiting until the political winds are firmly in one direction, or the outcome has already been decided, and then making an ambiguous statement that provides plausible deniability should things change...

in all actuality I don;t really see where the US is obligated to "rescue" US citizens who willingly put themselves in the predicament that foley did...
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Re: IRS scandale will be the downfall of the Obama Administr

Post by freeski »

madhatter wrote:in all actuality I don;t really see where the US is obligated to "rescue" US citizens who willingly put themselves in the predicament that foley did...
Foley was held captive in Libya by Gaddafi's thugs not that long ago. He was luckily set free and then said to himself: "I've got an idea, I'll go to Syria". It's a good thing there are journalists willing to go to dangerous places and cover the news, but they should not expect the U.S. is going to have their back if they are captured. There is a young 26 year old American girl being held by ISIS and they are requesting $6,600,000 for her release. She was working in a hospital or something. A very kind thing to do, but not a very smart from a self preservation angle.
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XtremeJibber2001
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Re: IRS scandale will be the downfall of the Obama Administr

Post by XtremeJibber2001 »

Bubba wrote:If you go back to the Bay of Pigs invasion, you'll understand the reluctance to simply go with the intelligence and military without thinking things through from every different angle. It's a lesson all presidents following JFK have learned, sometimes the hard way.
You don't have to go back that far - Iraq is the most recent case of not thinking things through.
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Re: IRS scandale will be the downfall of the Obama Administr

Post by madhatter »

XtremeJibber2001 wrote:
Bubba wrote:If you go back to the Bay of Pigs invasion, you'll understand the reluctance to simply go with the intelligence and military without thinking things through from every different angle. It's a lesson all presidents following JFK have learned, sometimes the hard way.
You don't have to go back that far - Iraq is the most recent case of not thinking things through.
Thank god he finally showed up...

Image

And rest assured obama will never make a pertinent decision w/o checking with him first...
mach es sehr schnell

'exponential reciprocation'- The practice of always giving back more than you take....
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