Net Neutrality - the real facts from the FCC Chairman

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Highway Star
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Re: Net Neutrality - the real facts from the FCC Chairman

Post by Highway Star »

Nikoli wrote:Yes, more than I trust verizon and gang.
The FCC Chairman's statements are extremely clear about FTC enforcing similar "bright line" rules - claims about blocking and throttling are just left wing fear mongering.
"I'M YELLING BECAUSE YOU DID SOMETHING COOL!" - Humpty Dumpty

"Kzone should bill you for the bandwidth you waste writing novels to try and prove a point, but end up just looking like a deranged narcissistic fool." - Deadheadskier at madhatter

"The key is to not be lame, and know it, and not give a rat's @$$ what anybody thinks......that's real cool." - Highway Star http://goo.gl/xJxo34" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

"I am one of the coolest people on the internet..." - Highway Star

"I have a tiny penis...." - C-Rex

XtremeJibber2001 - THE MAIN STREAM MEDIA HAS YOU COMPLETELY HYPNOTIZED. PLEASE WAKE UP AND LEARN HOW TO FILTER REALITY FROM BS NARRATIVES.

"Your life is only interesting when you capture the best, fakest, most curated split second version." - Team Robot regarding Instagram posters
Nikoli
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Re: Net Neutrality - the real facts from the FCC Chairman

Post by Nikoli »

Highway Star wrote:
Nikoli wrote:Let's go back to before the rules came into place. Wireless networks were exploding. The wireless companies were charging using gb / per month model and they were making god awful sums of money. They still are by the way. The cable companies wished they could do the same. There was talk in the industry of adding data caps on wired networks and trying gb / month models. The cable companies felt left out. Also, at the time the wireless carrier wouldn't allow you to piggyback off of your cell phone data. They wanted you to pay for tethering. Remember those days? Who's data is it? This is like the water authority charging you more to brush your teeth vs.take a shower.

Ask yourself this? Do you really trust these companies to do the right thing? (I don't) They are in business for one thing, to make money. Their current argument is that net neutrality gets in the way of them making money. This is just not true. The entire 4G networks of this country were built under net neutrality rules and not matter how they spin the numbers it just doesn't add up. At this point the internet is a necessity for modern life. Much like the highways of this country. Do you trust Verizon and Comcast and all of the other players to do the right thing?


One more thing, for the chairmen to try to bring twitter into the equation is petty on his part. It confuses the issue. He has shown his colors as a shill for the industry. The automated comments in favor of of repeal. I wonder who created that app and who paid for it? That's something I would love to know. Maybe congress should take a look at that. He should keep his mouth shut and take his payout.
Come on man. There's no free lunch. I pay $30 for tethering on my cell plan and $50 for true unlimited data, minus a small percentage discount I get. Then $50 for talk/text. After taxes its significantly over $100 per month. AND I still get throttled during video streaming and at some times of the day. AND I have to fully pay for my own phone.

I've considered switching back to a fiber connection, and getting a modern phone plan, for pretty much the same overall cost. But the convenience of having the mobile hotspot is great, the rate is locked in for now, and Verizon's service is excellent. When I get ready to upgrade my electronics to 4K resolution, I'm probably going to have to switch to fiber for streaming and large file downloads, but that's going to involve a $1k+ projector and a gaming PC with large storage - $3k total overall. Probably a couple years out for me.

4G has been around for quite a while now and it was built PRE Obama-net, under the title 1 rules. Why do you think the FFC Chairman pointed out that infrastructure investment is down under the new rules....?
We will agree to disagree.
And the sea will grant each man new hope . . .
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Highway Star
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Re: Net Neutrality - the real facts from the FCC Chairman

Post by Highway Star »

XtremeJibber2001 wrote:I expect this will eventually make its way into the courts / SCOTUS.

If/when Net Neutrality is repealed, ISPs will essentially be able to reduce bandwidth to whatever they wish and/or charge companies for better bandwidth. For example, Comcast could reduce bandwidth to Netflix and force Netflix to pay for more bandwidth ... a cost they will ultimately have to pay to stay in business, which will be passed onto the consumer in terms of fees.

Keeping with the Comcast example ... they recently promised not to do this ... until they didn't. https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/201 ... ed-repeal/

Meanwhile, Comcast and other ISPs own assertions during earnings calls that Title II has not impacted their bottom line or future plans.
More fantasy. Your scenario is completely unrealistic. Did you read my quote several posts up? Here it is again:
The report clarifies that the repeal of FCC Bright Line does not inhibit the FTC from enforcing an open internet, and regulation enforcement is delegated to the FTC heretofore. (FTC has a good record protecting consumers).

The FCC admits that this has the potential to become a problem. They claim it is highly unlikely because the FTC can come in and penetrate ISPs who act as monopolies. Plus, content providers (Google, Amazon, etc.) have an obscenely higher market capitalization than ISP's (Google alone has higher market cap than all ISP's combined), and that they can easily pressure ISPs to obey.

For example:

Comcast tries to throttle Netflix.

Netflix says f*** you we won't serve any of your Comcast kind here.

Comcast customers can't watch Stranger Things.

Comcast customers screech autistically.

Everyone (who can) leaves Comcast.

If nobody can leave Comcast, the FTC can declare Comcast a monopoly and bust their nuts.

Thus the FCC concludes it is unlikely that ISPs will paywall their content providers because content-providers will easily prevent them from doing it. FCC asserts that monopolies like Comcast will be combated with FTC anti-monopoly regulation, increased competition, and more ISP choices for customers that will drive price down and quality up. FCC will address individual ISP violations case by case if/when they arise.
This is even more so now that it's NBC-Comcast. Do you really think the FTC is going to let Comcast restrict the delivery of content they don't own...?

If anything, they may try to offer enhanced streaming for services like Netflix. They pay a small fee (pennies per customer) and get preferred network routing/prioritization and thus can offer better streaming experience. Free market forces at work, and everybody wins including the customer.

Has anybody actually used Comcast's new Xfinity service? It's actually REALLY good. I'm sure they don't feel too threatened by Netflix these days.
Last edited by Highway Star on Nov 30th, '17, 09:35, edited 2 times in total.
"I'M YELLING BECAUSE YOU DID SOMETHING COOL!" - Humpty Dumpty

"Kzone should bill you for the bandwidth you waste writing novels to try and prove a point, but end up just looking like a deranged narcissistic fool." - Deadheadskier at madhatter

"The key is to not be lame, and know it, and not give a rat's @$$ what anybody thinks......that's real cool." - Highway Star http://goo.gl/xJxo34" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

"I am one of the coolest people on the internet..." - Highway Star

"I have a tiny penis...." - C-Rex

XtremeJibber2001 - THE MAIN STREAM MEDIA HAS YOU COMPLETELY HYPNOTIZED. PLEASE WAKE UP AND LEARN HOW TO FILTER REALITY FROM BS NARRATIVES.

"Your life is only interesting when you capture the best, fakest, most curated split second version." - Team Robot regarding Instagram posters
madhatter
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Re: Net Neutrality - the real facts from the FCC Chairman

Post by madhatter »

Nikoli wrote:Yes, more than I trust verizon and gang.
you must be enjoying that 2500 per yr obamacare savings... :?c
mach es sehr schnell

'exponential reciprocation'- The practice of always giving back more than you take....
XtremeJibber2001
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Re: Net Neutrality - the real facts from the FCC Chairman

Post by XtremeJibber2001 »

Highway Star wrote:Come on man. There's no free lunch. I pay $30 for tethering on my cell plan and $50 for true unlimited data, minus a small percentage discount I get. Then $50 for talk/text. After taxes its significantly over $100 per month. AND I still get throttled during video streaming and at some times of the day. AND I have to fully pay for my own phone.
In a discussion about Net Neutrality (NN), I am having trouble understanding why you're using wireless as an example when NN is primarily about broadband.
HighwayStar wrote:The FCC Chairman's statements are extremely clear about FTC enforcing similar "bright line" rules - claims about blocking and throttling are just left wing fear mongering.
Can you point to any legislature, currently in place, which would prevent ISPs from blocking/throttling?
Highway Star
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Re: Net Neutrality - the real facts from the FCC Chairman

Post by Highway Star »

XtremeJibber2001 wrote:
Highway Star wrote:Come on man. There's no free lunch. I pay $30 for tethering on my cell plan and $50 for true unlimited data, minus a small percentage discount I get. Then $50 for talk/text. After taxes its significantly over $100 per month. AND I still get throttled during video streaming and at some times of the day. AND I have to fully pay for my own phone.
In a discussion about Net Neutrality (NN), I am having trouble understanding why you're using wireless as an example when NN is primarily about broadband.
HighwayStar wrote:The FCC Chairman's statements are extremely clear about FTC enforcing similar "bright line" rules - claims about blocking and throttling are just left wing fear mongering.
Can you point to any legislature, currently in place, which would prevent ISPs from blocking/throttling?
DID YOU READ THE FCC CHAIRMAN'S STATEMENT AT THE START OF THIS THREAD?????
"I'M YELLING BECAUSE YOU DID SOMETHING COOL!" - Humpty Dumpty

"Kzone should bill you for the bandwidth you waste writing novels to try and prove a point, but end up just looking like a deranged narcissistic fool." - Deadheadskier at madhatter

"The key is to not be lame, and know it, and not give a rat's @$$ what anybody thinks......that's real cool." - Highway Star http://goo.gl/xJxo34" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

"I am one of the coolest people on the internet..." - Highway Star

"I have a tiny penis...." - C-Rex

XtremeJibber2001 - THE MAIN STREAM MEDIA HAS YOU COMPLETELY HYPNOTIZED. PLEASE WAKE UP AND LEARN HOW TO FILTER REALITY FROM BS NARRATIVES.

"Your life is only interesting when you capture the best, fakest, most curated split second version." - Team Robot regarding Instagram posters
Highway Star
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Re: Net Neutrality - the real facts from the FCC Chairman

Post by Highway Star »

My wireless usage is a good example of market forces at work. Any way you cut it, you're going to pay about $60+ for broadband in the USA right now - it's going to be fast, reliable and offer nearly unlimited access to anything on the internet. And nothing is going to change that.
"I'M YELLING BECAUSE YOU DID SOMETHING COOL!" - Humpty Dumpty

"Kzone should bill you for the bandwidth you waste writing novels to try and prove a point, but end up just looking like a deranged narcissistic fool." - Deadheadskier at madhatter

"The key is to not be lame, and know it, and not give a rat's @$$ what anybody thinks......that's real cool." - Highway Star http://goo.gl/xJxo34" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

"I am one of the coolest people on the internet..." - Highway Star

"I have a tiny penis...." - C-Rex

XtremeJibber2001 - THE MAIN STREAM MEDIA HAS YOU COMPLETELY HYPNOTIZED. PLEASE WAKE UP AND LEARN HOW TO FILTER REALITY FROM BS NARRATIVES.

"Your life is only interesting when you capture the best, fakest, most curated split second version." - Team Robot regarding Instagram posters
Nikoli
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Re: Net Neutrality - the real facts from the FCC Chairman

Post by Nikoli »

madhatter wrote:
Nikoli wrote:Yes, more than I trust verizon and gang.
you must be enjoying that 2500 per yr obamacare savings... :?c
Not going to get into it but the pre existing condition mandate trumps the saving or lack there of in my case.
And the sea will grant each man new hope . . .
-Christopher Columbus
madhatter
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Re: Net Neutrality - the real facts from the FCC Chairman

Post by madhatter »

Nikoli wrote:
madhatter wrote:
Nikoli wrote:Yes, more than I trust verizon and gang.
you must be enjoying that 2500 per yr obamacare savings... :?c
Not going to get into it but the pre existing condition mandate trumps the saving or lack there of in my case.
that's why we all get to vote...its very rare I want more govt involved in anything, even when it "might" be to my advantage...
mach es sehr schnell

'exponential reciprocation'- The practice of always giving back more than you take....
XtremeJibber2001
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Re: Net Neutrality - the real facts from the FCC Chairman

Post by XtremeJibber2001 »

Highway Star wrote:My wireless usage is a good example of market forces at work. Any way you cut it, you're going to pay about $60+ for broadband in the USA right now - it's going to be fast, reliable and offer nearly unlimited access to anything on the internet. And nothing is going to change that.
I don't think it's a good example, you're an aberration, as most consumers are not on unlimited plans. Your 100GB per month would put you ~$200/month, not including your voice/text plan. This is where we may be headed without Net Neutrality. Would you pay $200+/month for the data you use?

If nothing is going to change our unlimited access to content on the internet ... why repeal NN if it won't have any impact?
madhatter
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Re: Net Neutrality - the real facts from the FCC Chairman

Post by madhatter »

XtremeJibber2001 wrote:
Highway Star wrote:My wireless usage is a good example of market forces at work. Any way you cut it, you're going to pay about $60+ for broadband in the USA right now - it's going to be fast, reliable and offer nearly unlimited access to anything on the internet. And nothing is going to change that.
I don't think it's a good example, you're an aberration, as most consumers are not on unlimited plans. Your 100GB per month would put you ~$200/month, not including your voice/text plan. This is where we may be headed without Net Neutrality. Would you pay $200+/month for the data you use?

If nothing is going to change our unlimited access to content on the internet ... why repeal NN if it won't have any impact?
so in essence you are advocating for govt price controls...that always works... :roll:
mach es sehr schnell

'exponential reciprocation'- The practice of always giving back more than you take....
Highway Star
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Re: Net Neutrality - the real facts from the FCC Chairman

Post by Highway Star »

XtremeJibber2001 wrote:
Highway Star wrote:My wireless usage is a good example of market forces at work. Any way you cut it, you're going to pay about $60+ for broadband in the USA right now - it's going to be fast, reliable and offer nearly unlimited access to anything on the internet. And nothing is going to change that.
I don't think it's a good example, you're an aberration, as most consumers are not on unlimited plans. Your 100GB per month would put you ~$200/month, not including your voice/text plan. This is where we may be headed without Net Neutrality. Would you pay $200+/month for the data you use?

If nothing is going to change our unlimited access to content on the internet ... why repeal NN if it won't have any impact?
No, I'm saying my unlimited usage is comparable to WIRED broadband usage and cost. The only people still on the legacy unlimited are hardcore cord cutters like myself, as it is comparable to a wired connection - Verizon has increased the cost to make it as such.

Stop calling it net neutrality. It's not that. It's FCC Title II rules that are being rolled back. The impact will be positive, as it will restore the competitive and startup friendly environment the internet had for 20 years, and promote investment.
"I'M YELLING BECAUSE YOU DID SOMETHING COOL!" - Humpty Dumpty

"Kzone should bill you for the bandwidth you waste writing novels to try and prove a point, but end up just looking like a deranged narcissistic fool." - Deadheadskier at madhatter

"The key is to not be lame, and know it, and not give a rat's @$$ what anybody thinks......that's real cool." - Highway Star http://goo.gl/xJxo34" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

"I am one of the coolest people on the internet..." - Highway Star

"I have a tiny penis...." - C-Rex

XtremeJibber2001 - THE MAIN STREAM MEDIA HAS YOU COMPLETELY HYPNOTIZED. PLEASE WAKE UP AND LEARN HOW TO FILTER REALITY FROM BS NARRATIVES.

"Your life is only interesting when you capture the best, fakest, most curated split second version." - Team Robot regarding Instagram posters
XtremeJibber2001
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Re: Net Neutrality - the real facts from the FCC Chairman

Post by XtremeJibber2001 »

Highway Star wrote:
XtremeJibber2001 wrote:
Highway Star wrote:My wireless usage is a good example of market forces at work. Any way you cut it, you're going to pay about $60+ for broadband in the USA right now - it's going to be fast, reliable and offer nearly unlimited access to anything on the internet. And nothing is going to change that.
I don't think it's a good example, you're an aberration, as most consumers are not on unlimited plans. Your 100GB per month would put you ~$200/month, not including your voice/text plan. This is where we may be headed without Net Neutrality. Would you pay $200+/month for the data you use?

If nothing is going to change our unlimited access to content on the internet ... why repeal NN if it won't have any impact?
No, I'm saying my unlimited usage is comparable to WIRED broadband usage and cost. The only people still on the legacy unlimited are hardcore cord cutters like myself, as it is comparable to a wired connection - Verizon has increased the cost to make it as such.

Stop calling it net neutrality. It's not that. It's FCC Title II rules that are being rolled back. The impact will be positive, as it will restore the competitive and startup friendly environment the internet had for 20 years, and promote investment.
Why repeal NN if it won't have any impact as you asserted before/above?
Highway Star
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Re: Net Neutrality - the real facts from the FCC Chairman

Post by Highway Star »

XtremeJibber2001 wrote:
Highway Star wrote:
XtremeJibber2001 wrote:
Highway Star wrote:My wireless usage is a good example of market forces at work. Any way you cut it, you're going to pay about $60+ for broadband in the USA right now - it's going to be fast, reliable and offer nearly unlimited access to anything on the internet. And nothing is going to change that.
I don't think it's a good example, you're an aberration, as most consumers are not on unlimited plans. Your 100GB per month would put you ~$200/month, not including your voice/text plan. This is where we may be headed without Net Neutrality. Would you pay $200+/month for the data you use?

If nothing is going to change our unlimited access to content on the internet ... why repeal NN if it won't have any impact?
No, I'm saying my unlimited usage is comparable to WIRED broadband usage and cost. The only people still on the legacy unlimited are hardcore cord cutters like myself, as it is comparable to a wired connection - Verizon has increased the cost to make it as such.

Stop calling it net neutrality. It's not that. It's FCC Title II rules that are being rolled back. The impact will be positive, as it will restore the competitive and startup friendly environment the internet had for 20 years, and promote investment.
Why repeal NN if it won't have any impact as you asserted before/above?
Net Neutrality, or for all intents and purposes having a set of rules/framework/oversight that provides what is commonly thought of as net neutrality, is NOT being repealed or removed, only tweaked in the exact execution of it. The regulating process for ISP's is being reverted. Period.

I'm starting to conclude that you're extremely ill informed on this topic or having a hard time grasping it.
"I'M YELLING BECAUSE YOU DID SOMETHING COOL!" - Humpty Dumpty

"Kzone should bill you for the bandwidth you waste writing novels to try and prove a point, but end up just looking like a deranged narcissistic fool." - Deadheadskier at madhatter

"The key is to not be lame, and know it, and not give a rat's @$$ what anybody thinks......that's real cool." - Highway Star http://goo.gl/xJxo34" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

"I am one of the coolest people on the internet..." - Highway Star

"I have a tiny penis...." - C-Rex

XtremeJibber2001 - THE MAIN STREAM MEDIA HAS YOU COMPLETELY HYPNOTIZED. PLEASE WAKE UP AND LEARN HOW TO FILTER REALITY FROM BS NARRATIVES.

"Your life is only interesting when you capture the best, fakest, most curated split second version." - Team Robot regarding Instagram posters
XtremeJibber2001
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Re: Net Neutrality - the real facts from the FCC Chairman

Post by XtremeJibber2001 »

Highway Star wrote:
XtremeJibber2001 wrote:
Highway Star wrote: - it's going to be fast, reliable and offer nearly unlimited access to anything on the internet. And nothing is going to change that.
Why repeal NN if it won't have any impact as you asserted before/above?
Net Neutrality, or for all intents and purposes having a set of rules/framework/oversight that provides what is commonly thought of as net neutrality, is NOT being repealed or removed, only tweaked in the exact execution of it. The regulating process for ISP's is being reverted. Period.

I'm starting to conclude that you're extremely ill informed on this topic or having a hard time grasping it.
So tweaking NN is not going to have an impact, but it's being tweaked anyway, but the tweaking will have no impact? I don't understand. Your assertions seem at odds with one another.
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