Sheehan: War is 'wrong and immoral'

[XtremeJibber2001]

So GWB orded the deaths of 100,000 innocent people, no, not quite Ms. Sheehan.

W ordered this war that has killed thousands of innocent Iraqis...

Spin it however you want - who killed who doesn't matter.. Fact is they are dead because we invaded and messed everything up...

Well, I wasn't going to say anything, but you said I can spin it how I want ...

If we weren't in Iraq the last 3-4 years ... many more than 100,000 innocent people may have died.

Saddam is alleged to have killed over 300,000 innocent Iraqi's.

Alledged? Your coming at me with alledged??
After you chastized people for Marines alledgedly raping and killing???

Practice what you preach brother...

Yes, I am saying "alleged". That's much different than Murtha saying "Our soldiers raped and killed innocent civilians."

If you notice, in Murtha's statement, there is no acknowledgement that the report he was commenting was merely alleged. In fact, these Marines that were accused were in Military Prisons in San Diego before they were even charged, again the Military and the media were treating the Marines like convicted felons ... convieneintly leaving out that the soldiers had not been charged, hell, they even left out 'allegedly' from their reports. This is similar to the post CS made where I said the article was not confirmed, but merely alleged. However the source he posted neglected to acknowledge that fact. Of course it came back to bite them [the media source] in the ass.

So I am practicing what I preach. If it's alleged, then it's alleged [it's not proven].

When people cite numbers like Sheehan did/does and media outlets post polls, I like to see the numbers and see if they're being misrepresented as they often are.

As you can see above, Sheehan's number of 100K is accurate, but our troops did not kill all 100K. Most of which, in any account, is collateral or accidental death, which Sheehan ironically leaves out of her rant.

Another good example of misrepresenting data was when the '04 election was coming to an end and Ohio was the last significant state to get in their electoral votes. Polls on many media outlets showed Kerry winning by a landslide. Of course, that didn't pan out, but it's a great misrepresentation of the stats.

We have a long road ahead to decrease innocent deaths, but we're doing much better than we did in WWII. Hopefully, as you and I have agreed previously, less or no war will obviously reduce civilian casualties to nill.

[BigKahuna13]

If the country (in your own eyes) is broken, then wouldn't a true patriot remain and attempt to change it?

Yeah a true patriot would but then again I don't think Ms Sheehan is a true patriot, IMHO, and that's not what she said, she said she would rather live under Chavez, I'm saying put your money where your mouth is.

What you're suggesting isn't what she said either. She said she'd rather under Chavez instead of Bush, not in Venuzela instead of the United States.

Unless she's being very loose with her language I read that as a criticism of the President not the country.

Well unless Mr Chavez is planning on taking over the United States which is the only way Ms Sheehan could live under him without leaving the United States, and I'd be happy to see her do just that, would be for her to move to Venezuela, unless or course you see a different way. If I'm missing something could you please point it out, thanking you in advance for your enlightenment.

It's really simple. By comparing Bush to Chavez and saying she'd rather live under Chavez than Bush she is criticizing the President - or as XJ noted the President's policies. That is not a criticism of the country. It is a criticism of the President. You can love the country and all that it is supposed to stand for while hating the current President or the entire current government for that matter. President does not equal Country. Government does not equal Country. Why is that so hard to understand?

[shortski]

f*** you - patronizing Nazi....

Back to the ignore for you...

Ah DMC, I'm not trying to upset you, don't want you having nightmares or anything, but I'm an Admin, you can put me on ignore but my posts will still show up, the php software is set up that you can't ignore an Admin, kind of like being the Supreme Master of the Universe, sorry.

Your pal, Shortski

[XtremeJibber2001]

President does not equal Country. Government does not equal Country. Why is that so hard to understand?

I agree with your post, but I wish the whole World knew this tidbit of information.

[shortski]

It's really simple. By comparing Bush to Chavez and saying she'd rather live under Chavez than Bush she is criticizing the President - or as XJ noted the President's policies. That is not a criticism of the country. It is a criticism of the President. You can love the country and all that it is supposed to stand for while hating the current President or the entire current government for that matter. President does not equal Country. Government does not equal Country. Why is that so hard to understand?

Well unless Mr Chavez is planning on taking over the United States which is the only way Ms Sheehan could live under him without leaving the United States, I want her to be happy and she has it within her power to make herself happy by moving to Venuzula. If she was truly criticizing the president and not the country why not just say that rather than bring up a "president" from a country that is clearly not an ally of the United States
"

Why is that so hard to understand?

"

[BigKahuna13]

It's really simple. By comparing Bush to Chavez and saying she'd rather live under Chavez than Bush she is criticizing the President - or as XJ noted the President's policies. That is not a criticism of the country. It is a criticism of the President. You can love the country and all that it is supposed to stand for while hating the current President or the entire current government for that matter. President does not equal Country. Government does not equal Country. Why is that so hard to understand?

Well unless Mr Chavez is planning on taking over the United States which is the only way Ms Sheehan could live under him without leaving the United States, I want her to be happy and she has it within her power to make herself happy by moving to Venuzula. If she was truly criticizing the president and not the country why not just say that rather than bring up a "president" from a country that is clearly not an ally of the United Stated "

Why is that so hard to understand?

"

Madonna I give up. I have to believe that you're yanking my chain because no one can be that dense.

[shortski]

Madonna I give up. I have to believe that you're yanking my chain because no one can be that dense.

Moi, yank your chain, ques que ce... yanking chain? I don't go that way, not that there's anything wrong with that.

[DMC Freeride]

f*** you - patronizing Nazi....

Back to the ignore for you...

Ah DMC, I'm not trying to upset you, don't want you having nightmares or anything, but I'm an Admin, you can put me on ignore but my posts will still show up, the php software is set up that you can't ignore an Admin, kind of like being the Supreme Master of the Universe, sorry.

Your pal, Shortski

Then go f u ck yourself - I'm off the board...

Friggin asswipe...

This is total sh*t... If I can't hide your Nazi rantings and lack of symapthy for military families and what they have to go throught...
then I guess you've won and theres no room for my rantings...


Later all... Shortski is an ass - people who know me know how to contact me...

Enjoy your Nazi Moderater...

[shortski]

f*** you - patronizing Nazi....

Back to the ignore for you...

Ah DMC, I'm not trying to upset you, don't want you having nightmares or anything, but I'm an Admin, you can put me on ignore but my posts will still show up, the php software is set up that you can't ignore an Admin, kind of like being the Supreme Master of the Universe, sorry.

Your pal, Shortski

Then go f u ck yourself - I'm off the board...

Friggin asswipe...

If you're really gone you wont see this but if you're not please don't go. I really love the time we get to spend together, tell you what, if I become a totally crazed liberal would all be forgiven, please say yes....I don't know how I or KZone are going to survive whit-out the joy that is you, please stay pretty please, I'll even vote Democratic in the next election I get to vote in.

Your Pal,

[Dirty Old Ski Bastard]

f*** you - patronizing Nazi....

Back to the ignore for you...

Ah DMC, I'm not trying to upset you, don't want you having nightmares or anything, but I'm an Admin, you can put me on ignore but my posts will still show up, the php software is set up that you can't ignore an Admin, kind of like being the Supreme Master of the Universe, sorry.

Your pal, Shortski

Then go f u ck yourself - I'm off the board...

Friggin asswipe...

If you're really gone you wont see this but if you're not please don't go. I really love the time we get to spend together, tell you what, if I become a totally crazed liberal would all be forgiven, please say yes....I don't know how I or KZone are going to survive whit-out the joy that is you, please stay pretty please, I'll even vote Democratic in the next election I get to vote in.

Your Pal,

Too late, he and Cindy just took the next plane to Venezuela to go find Chavez!!!

Typical Liberal Loser!!!!

BUMMA

[Bubba]

f*** you - patronizing Nazi....

Have you considered the possibility that people can disagree without personal attack? I'm not sure where this reaction came from - Shortski didn't attack you, he disagreed with your opinion...as usual.

[XtremeJibber2001]

In other news ... Glenn Beck sent Cindy Sheehan a pizza.

I've got to be honest, I enjoy Beck's show, purely for it's comedy.

[Dr. NO]

f*** you - patronizing Nazi....

Back to the ignore for you...

Ah DMC, I'm not trying to upset you, don't want you having nightmares or anything, but I'm an Admin, you can put me on ignore but my posts will still show up, the php software is set up that you can't ignore an Admin, kind of like being the Supreme Master of the Universe, sorry.

Your pal, Shortski

Then go f u ck yourself - I'm off the board...

Friggin asswipe...

This is total sh*t... If I can't hide your Nazi rantings and lack of symapthy for military families and what they have to go throught...
then I guess you've won and theres no room for my rantings...


Later all... Shortski is an ass - people who know me know how to contact me...

Enjoy your Nazi Moderater...

Shortski - Nazi douchebag..... Moderator and asswipe - if I you can't ignore an asshole like Shortski - who happens to be a moderator then this board is total sh*t...

DANG, DMC, Shortski must have said something really really bad to bring this about. Guess the pot really did get stired. Catch you elsewhere.