Mud slide

[ski]

Lots of pics and vids here:

https://www.reddit.com/r/vermont/?mc_ci ... 4ac9b34287

and here:

https://vtdigger.org/2023/07/10/photos- ... 4ac9b34287

[Bubba]

Anyone hear from shortski?

He commented on at least one Facebook post as Flea Bailey, his latest alter ego.

[G-smashed]

I'm glad Shortski's OK. Anyone hear about Drewski's? What about the Long Trail brewery. I saw a video of the corner of 4 and 100S and the gas station as well as the Back Behind were surrounded by water.

[Big Bob]

Someone commited on Facebook that there was a recent mudslide on Valley Plunge. Also sounds like limited traffic being allowed on portions of Rt 4.

Killington police annonced Rt 4 opened at 4:15 this afternoon.

[newpylong1]

Yep lookers right from tower two on down. Front of the lodge has standing water outside, hopefully minimal interior damage.

[Big Bob]

https://www.reddit.com/r/vermont/commen ... and_after/

[ANGUS]

Southwest NH took a pounding. Roads gone. Some of my equipment is pinned in. I'm told I cant make it to K town with equipment. I have to serve my community first. Does anyone have any life threatening needs? I can send quads up. BLS/ALS.

[Big Bob]

Some of the pictures I have seen of the washed out sections of East Mnt Road show the gravel base of the road. It looks like 4' of crushed ledge, maybe 2" minus. When Vt rebuilt the road in the Bethel area along the White River, Rt 106?, the imported larger chunks of blasted ledge for fill. Suitcase to basketball size. This stuff will not wash away as quickly as the finer material. Maybe that is what the town should look at. Cover the top with choke stone and maybe 6" of 2' minus gravel, then pave. Even if the top surface washes away it should still be passable. And much larger driveway culvert pipes. I read where engineers design drainage for 50 year events, is this true Stormchaser?

[Stormchaser]

Some of the pictures I have seen of the washed out sections of East Mnt Road show the gravel base of the road. It looks like 4' of crushed ledge, maybe 2" minus. When Vt rebuilt the road in the Bethel area along the White River, Rt 106?, the imported larger chunks of blasted ledge for fill. Suitcase to basketball size. This stuff will not wash away as quickly as the finer material. Maybe that is what the town should look at. Cover the top with choke stone and maybe 6" of 2' minus gravel, then pave. Even if the top surface washes away it should still be passable. And much larger driveway culvert pipes. I read where engineers underdesign drainage or 50 year events, is this true Stormchaser?

Truth is for driveways; most aren't even engineered. In municipal roadways, culverts are likely only designed to handle what's been called a 10- or 25-year storm... Problem is that rainfall intensities have increased over the last 50 years and what was a 10-year, or 25-year storm is much more frequent today. Used to be once every ten years you'd get a rainstorm that produced 4.5" of r*in in 24 hours. But now due to increased intensities, now you get that storm once every 2 years. So what was a 10-year storm, is now a 2-year storm...but that nomenclature hasn't been revised, so you hear people say things like 'we got two 50-year storm events in a ten-year period'...which is kind of a misnomer. Doesn't help that most culvert design is still based on rainfall intensity mapping from 1961.

And don't get me started on 50-, 100-, and 500- year flood events. Calling something a '500-year flood event', again is an even bigger misnomer. What that event actually is...a r*in event that creates flooding of that extent has a likely occurrence of 0.2 percent in any given year (1/500). So add up all the 0.2% chances in a 500-year period and you end up with a 100% chance it will happen at least once, and thus the '500-year flood' designation. But dumbing it down like that makes it harder to understand that you can easily have more than one event of that magnitude in a 500-year span, as there is a chance every year (0.2%) for this event to occur. They should call it annual 0.2% flood chance. That's easier to understand.

[f.a.s.t.]

When are we going to start having 100 year and 500 year winter snow storms every year??????

[jimmywilson69]

Truth is for driveways; most aren't even engineered. In municipal roadways, culverts are likely only designed to handle what's been called a 10- or 25-year storm... Problem is that rainfall intensities have increased over the last 50 years and what was a 10-year, or 25-year storm is much more frequent today. Used to be once every ten years you'd get a rainstorm that produced 4.5" of r*in in 24 hours. But now due to increased intensities, now you get that storm once every 2 years. So what was a 10-year storm, is now a 2-year storm...but that nomenclature hasn't been revised, so you hear people say things like 'we got two 50-year storm events in a ten-year period'...which is kind of a misnomer. Doesn't help that most culvert design is still based on rainfall intensity mapping from 1961.

And don't get me started on 50-, 100-, and 500- year flood events. Calling something a '500-year flood event', again is an even bigger misnomer. What that event actually is...a r*in event that creates flooding of that extent has a likely occurrence of 0.2 percent in any given year (1/500). So add up all the 0.2% chances in a 500-year period and you end up with a 100% chance it will happen at least once, and thus the '500-year flood' designation. But dumbing it down like that makes it harder to understand that you can easily have more than one event of that magnitude in a 500-year span, as there is a chance every year (0.2%) for this event to occur. They should call it annual 0.2% flood chance. That's easier to understand.

Very well said Sir. I was going to post something similar, but you got this...

This is what VT's 2nd "100+ year event" in the past 12 years?

The way it r*ins has changed dramatically in the past 20ish years. you can argue about all kinds of things related to climate change, but the rainfall changes is a truth.

[Stormchaser]

Truth is for driveways; most aren't even engineered. In municipal roadways, culverts are likely only designed to handle what's been called a 10- or 25-year storm... Problem is that rainfall intensities have increased over the last 50 years and what was a 10-year, or 25-year storm is much more frequent today. Used to be once every ten years you'd get a rainstorm that produced 4.5" of r*in in 24 hours. But now due to increased intensities, now you get that storm once every 2 years. So what was a 10-year storm, is now a 2-year storm...but that nomenclature hasn't been revised, so you hear people say things like 'we got two 50-year storm events in a ten-year period'...which is kind of a misnomer. Doesn't help that most culvert design is still based on rainfall intensity mapping from 1961.

And don't get me started on 50-, 100-, and 500- year flood events. Calling something a '500-year flood event', again is an even bigger misnomer. What that event actually is...a r*in event that creates flooding of that extent has a likely occurrence of 0.2 percent in any given year (1/500). So add up all the 0.2% chances in a 500-year period and you end up with a 100% chance it will happen at least once, and thus the '500-year flood' designation. But dumbing it down like that makes it harder to understand that you can easily have more than one event of that magnitude in a 500-year span, as there is a chance every year (0.2%) for this event to occur. They should call it annual 0.2% flood chance. That's easier to understand.

Very well said Sir. I was going to post something similar, but you got this...

This is what VT's 2nd "100+ year event" in the past 12 years?

The way it r*ins has changed dramatically in the past 20ish years. you can argue about all kinds of things related to climate change, but the rainfall changes is a truth.

I've said for years we really should be spending more money adapting to a changing climate...

[Southside_Bobby]

How did the infrastructure rebuilt after Irene hold up? It did seem like one of the only major routes in the area that remained open this week (from K through Mendon down to Rutland) was one of the hardest hit by Irene.

Was this true of other newer infrastructure around the state? If so, that is good news.

[Stormchaser]

How did the infrastructure rebuilt after Irene hold up? It did seem like one of the only major routes in the area that remained open this week (from K through Mendon down to Rutland) was one of the hardest hit by Irene.

Was this true of other newer infrastructure around the state? If so, that is good news.

Irene affected the K basin down to Rutland much harder than this last storm, which seemed to locally concentrate in the Falls Brook and Ottauquechee watersheds.

[Mistergiff]

How did the infrastructure rebuilt after Irene hold up? It did seem like one of the only major routes in the area that remained open this week (from K through Mendon down to Rutland) was one of the hardest hit by Irene.

Was this true of other newer infrastructure around the state? If so, that is good news.

VT Digger did a report on Waterbury which took on much less damage than during Irene but had a higher crest on the Winooski. Sounds like the infrastructure work done there post Irene really paid off. https://vtdigger.org/2023/07/11/a-flood ... ins-again/