$6.00 gas?

[Mister Moose]

Moose, so you agree Biden didn't cause high gas prices?

I wouldn't agree with that.
While Biden did not cause COVID or the economic slowdown, or the resulting recovery once COVID eased, (yes, he participated in getting vaccines out there) the resulting surge in oil demand and resultant recent increase in high gasoline prices was not directly attributable to him. However -

• Biden was VP under Obama and in the Senate for 36 years. He was never known for an energy independent stance.
  As President Biden made moves to decrease infrastructure, increase red tape and decrease new Federal oil leases.
  President Biden has called for lowering reliance on oil, and increasing renewables.

These actions are not conducive to low oil or gasoline prices. So Biden contributed to higher gasoline prices during his career, and he took action as President to cause higher prices than would other wise occur in the future.

And under his administration there has been more drilling, right?

No, the article you posted states that under Biden there have been more drilling permits issued. That is not the same as more drilling. Furthermore, the yield of those permits is unproven. New leases (and permits) may be required to find viable wells. Biden has taken action to restrict that, not enable that. And as earlier stated, Biden was forced to allow those permits, ie a court order reversed his moratorium. So Biden was neither responsible for the increased demand for permits, nor their approval.

And he's receiving criticism from environmentalists for not doing more to curb drilling?

Yes. Apparently those folks don't read Kzone or Audabon .org.

[Bubba]

Moose, so you agree Biden didn't cause high gas prices?

I wouldn't agree with that.
While Biden did not cause COVID or the economic slowdown, or the resulting recovery once COVID eased, (yes, he participated in getting vaccines out there) the resulting surge in oil demand and resultant recent increase in high gasoline prices was not directly attributable to him. However -

• Biden was VP under Obama and in the Senate for 36 years. He was never known for an energy independent stance.
  As President Biden made moves to decrease infrastructure, increase red tape and decrease new Federal oil leases.
  President Biden has called for lowering reliance on oil, and increasing renewables.

These actions are not conducive to low oil or gasoline prices. So Biden contributed to higher gasoline prices during his career, and he took action as President to cause higher prices than would other wise occur in the future.

And under his administration there has been more drilling, right?

No, the article you posted states that under Biden there have been more drilling permits issued. That is not the same as more drilling. Furthermore, the yield of those permits is unproven. New leases (and permits) may be required to find viable wells. Biden has taken action to restrict that, not enable that. And as earlier stated, Biden was forced to allow those permits, ie a court order reversed his moratorium. So Biden was neither responsible for the increased demand for permits, nor their approval.

And he's receiving criticism from environmentalists for not doing more to curb drilling?

Yes. Apparently those folks don't read Kzone or Audabon .org.

Apparently all those negative steps have resulted in oil production increasing from a pandemic low of 9+ million BPD to over 11 million BPD in February, an increase of about 2 million. The recovery will continue as the industry recovers from multiple bankruptcies, well shut-ins, etc. Pipelines are still being built although not fast enough to move all the new natural gas to where it’s needed. Tar sands production continues in Alberta, moving to refineries primarily by pipeline and rail. While neither Biden nor many Democrats have been publicly supportive of the industry, they put few if any real roadblocks in the way of production, public posture aside. This administration talks about cutting our need for oil but does little to nothing to actually hinder production.

[deadheadskier]

Moose, so you agree Biden didn't cause high gas prices?

I wouldn't agree with that.
While Biden did not cause COVID or the economic slowdown, or the resulting recovery once COVID eased, (yes, he participated in getting vaccines out there) the resulting surge in oil demand and resultant recent increase in high gasoline prices was not directly attributable to him. However -

• Biden was VP under Obama and in the Senate for 36 years. He was never known for an energy independent stance.
  As President Biden made moves to decrease infrastructure, increase red tape and decrease new Federal oil leases.
  President Biden has called for lowering reliance on oil, and increasing renewables.

These actions are not conducive to low oil or gasoline prices. So Biden contributed to higher gasoline prices during his career, and he took action as President to cause higher prices than would other wise occur in the future.

And under his administration there has been more drilling, right?

No, the article you posted states that under Biden there have been more drilling permits issued. That is not the same as more drilling. Furthermore, the yield of those permits is unproven. New leases (and permits) may be required to find viable wells. Biden has taken action to restrict that, not enable that. And as earlier stated, Biden was forced to allow those permits, ie a court order reversed his moratorium. So Biden was neither responsible for the increased demand for permits, nor their approval.

And he's receiving criticism from environmentalists for not doing more to curb drilling?

Yes. Apparently those folks don't read Kzone or Audabon .org.

Seeing as how you fancy yourself a fuel price expert and are freely throwing blame at Biden for the current pain at the pump, how did Bush F up when gas got to $4.11/gallon in summer 2008? Much more painful when factoring inflation by the way.

Were you blaming the President back then too?

[Mister Moose]

Apparently all those negative steps have resulted in oil production increasing from a pandemic low of 9+ million BPD to over 11 million BPD in February, an increase of about 2 million. The recovery will continue as the industry recovers from multiple bankruptcies, well shut-ins, etc. Pipelines are still being built although not fast enough to move all the new natural gas to where it’s needed. Tar sands production continues in Alberta, moving to refineries primarily by pipeline and rail. While neither Biden nor many Democrats have been publicly supportive of the industry, they put few if any real roadblocks in the way of production, public posture aside. This administration talks about cutting our need for oil but does little to nothing to actually hinder production.

C'mon Bubba, surely production throttling is different than new well drilling. "Few, if any" doesn't equate to moratoriums. Anwar?

Seeing as how you fancy yourself a fuel price expert and are freely throwing blame at Biden for the current pain at the pump, how did Bush F up when gas got to $4.11/gallon in summer 2008? Much more painful when factoring inflation by the way.

Were you blaming the President back then too?

Sorry, reading comprehension and trolling.

[easyrider16]

Moose it seems like most of your arguments are pretty semantic. Regardless of Biden's views, past conduct, or the things he's said, it is pretty hard to argue that Biden can be blamed for current gas prices. The market has had a lot more to do with it than politics, and that has likely been true for most of the last decade.

[Mister Moose]

Moose, so you agree Biden didn't cause high gas prices?

Moose it seems like most of your arguments are pretty semantic. Regardless of Biden's views, past conduct, or the things he's said, it is pretty hard to argue that Biden can be blamed for current gas prices. The market has had a lot more to do with it than politics, and that has likely been true for most of the last decade.

You're moving the goal posts from in general to current. You ignore the real controls government has on oil leases on Federal lands, and permitting for drilling and pipelines. You ignore the poor investment climate Biden's statements and actions make to the oil industry. Then you call such discussion semantics. Other than that, you're pretty much spot on.

[easyrider16]

No, I haven't moved the goal posts. This discussion from the start has been about current prices. You're once again attributing claims to me that I didn't make, and making semantic arguments about the language I used to convey my argument. I'm not interested in responding to those things.

My point, from the start, has been that Biden is not to blame for the current surge in gas prices. It has been a function of the market, not politics. You have provided no evidence to dispute those claims.

*With one caveat - now that Biden has banned Russian oil, that's going to increase prices, and that is directly attributable to him. But that happened after this discussion started.

[boston_e]

By a CNN writer which means the republicans on here won't bother to read it and write it off as fake news and some of the liberals will take it as gospel, but some interesting discussion and points.

https://www.newspressnow.com/news/natio ... 4db00.html

Interesting comments about crude oil from the US being lighter and different from what we import - anyone care to research and share info on this?

Also interesting about permits under Biden being on pace as from under the Trump administration.

[Bubba]

By a CNN writer which means the republicans on here won't bother to read it and write it off as fake news and some of the liberals will take it as gospel, but some interesting discussion and points.

https://www.newspressnow.com/news/natio ... 4db00.html

Interesting comments about crude oil from the US being lighter and different from what we import - anyone care to research and share info on this?

Also interesting about permits under Biden being on pace as from under the Trump administration.

WTI is light sweet crude
Saudi oil and others in the area tend to the light side
Russian oil tends to be heavier
Venezuelan crude is definitely heavy
Tar sands is gunk
Not sure about Alaskan production.

US Gulf Coast (and other) refineries put in crackers years ago to handle the heavier oil coming from Venezuela which also works with tar sands and other heavies. Tar sands production comes to Illinois and Gulf Coast refineries via the Keystone pipeline. Alaskan crude typically goes to the West Coast or is exported to Asia. Light crudes can go anywhere but are also more expensive.

[asher2789]

The concept of energy independence by pumping more oil doesn't make much sense to me. To the extent the US uses oil for energy, we will be affected by the world market. Even if we were a net exporter, it wouldn't mean our oil prices wouldn't shoot up if Russia or another big oil producing country decided to cut production. It wouldn't stop oil prices from soaring if demand surged. I think the only way for the US to be truly energy independent is by turning from oil to nuclear and renewables.

On a similar note, it seems to me that if the US were a net exporter of oil, it would not change the fact that Russia makes a lot of cash producing oil, and would not change the geopolitical landscape much at all.

EXACTLY.

we could produce double what we even use and the price would still be determined by financial speculation and global markets because its a globally traded commodity. biden cutting off russian sales isnt gonna do sh*t except make him a one term president, which given his multiple failures on every level from the handling of COVID to inflation to broken promises to those who put him in office was already a likelihood.

cant wait for the fascist white christian theocratic dictatorship to arrive partially in 2022 and fully in 2024! /s

[ANGUS]

The cost of fuel lately is painful. I've never paid this much for diesel. Even in 08. When it goes over $6.00. Could be any time now. I'm pulling my trucks off the road. Good luck getting a Prius down the un plowed road. Contract or not. We cant afford or are paid enough to plow and salt. My CAT and Cummins don't run on sunshine and rainbows. Less income. Less spent at a mountain. My 2 cents.

[throbster]

Home heating oil at $5:00. Inflation is Sleepy's tax hike on the poor and middle class.

[G-smashed]

You are not poor if you're a regular at K and you certainly have no class. Back on topic gas prices may be stabilizing here in north NJ. I actually saw one station come down a couple of cents in the last day. I guess I can afford the extra $50 to come up there for the demolition party next week.

[throbster]

You are not poor if you're a regular at K and you certainly have no class. Back on topic gas prices may be stabilizing here in north NJ. I actually saw one station come down a couple of cents in the last day. I guess I can afford the extra $50 to come up there for the demolition party next week.

I wasn't referring to just me, bonehead. Lay off the goombays, they're imparing your thinking organ.

[easyrider16]

Since when do far-right wingers care about poor people? I thought those people were supposed to lift themselves up by their own bootstraps. If they can't afford the price of gas, maybe they should get better jobs, isn't that supposed to be the line?