Killington Ministar & Superstar Ski School Prices!!!

[laseranimal]

unless their plan works and people will pay a premium for their product

and since when has skiing EVER been accessable to the lower class?

[Bubba]

unless their plan works and people will pay a premium for their product

and since when has skiing EVER been accessable to the lower class?

Plain and simple, they're doing the classic marketing exercise of raising prices and looking for the price point at which they maximize revenue. Nobody should be surprised. They expect to increase prices, have lower skier visits but improve revenues as a result of higher revenue per customer. If they go too far, they lose money rather than make money. They've hopefully done enough market research to justify their pricing. If not, they turn people off, chase them away, hurt their long term customer relationships and fail to achieve their goals. If you don't like their pricing, you have two options:

1. Vote with your feet and go elsewhere

2. Employ public pressure via contacting the Rutland Herald, ski and other travel magazines and, even more importantly, media in Killington's major market areas. They will, within the next month or two, be doing stories on the upcoming ski season and the threat of such negative publicity, piled on top of already negative publicity from other actions, may just have an impact. Of course, you can always picket Killington at the various ski shows around the northeast. That might get their attention too.

Quite frankly, I can understand many of their moves to date, even if I think they've handled them ham handedly, to say the least, from a PR point of view. Turning families away with such a drastic increase is, in my opinion, a damn stupid long term strategy.

[ski the trees]

if they phased in the px increases we prob never have any of these discussions. granted there seems to be a lack of vision and reluctance to spend money on improvements but it's still early days and people are willing to give a little time on both points... (even though other mountains have moved aggressively from the get go).

[Chaz]

I am making more Phone calls to Killington to voice my displeasure.
Does anybody have the email address of Killington/Powder management?

Who can we contact at the local papers?

P.S how is KSC managing this?
What does KSC Management say?


Chaz

[Bubba]

I am making more Phone calls to Killington to voice my displeasure.
Does anybody have the email address of Killington/Powder management?

Who can we contact at the local papers?

P.S how is KSC managing this?
What does KSC Management say?


Chaz

If you look in the Ask K Forum, in the thread about who in K management is participating, you'll see several e-mail addresses. All Killington people have the same e-mail format.

www.RutlandHerald.com - on the left side is a link to contacts. Bruce Edwards is the guy who writes most of the articles on Killington. His e-mail address is listed among the contacts. There's also a way to write a letter to the editor through the website.

And, yes, ski the trees, I agree with you. This is one increase, even if justifiable, that they should've phased in over a couple of years.

[Ski-N-Sail]

There are no email addresses in there that I could find.

I believe most of their email addresses are their first initial and last name.

Send one to Chris Nyberg, the PRez. cnyberg@killington.com (assuming I have the spelling right.)

I emailed management on September 19, but have yet to hear anything back. I would assume that they are probably inundated with complaints.

[Bubba]

There are no email addresses in there that I could find.

I believe most of their email addresses are their first initial and last name.

Send one to Chris Nyberg, the PRez. cnyberg@killington.com (assuming I have the spelling right.)

I emailed management on September 19, but have yet to hear anything back. I would assume that they are probably inundated with complaints.

I'm sorry, you're correct. The e-mail addresses are not listed there. I thought we put them there but I guess not. My bad...

You are, however, right with the first initial, last name format and you have Chris's name correct.

[Steve]

I voted with my feet.

I have actually found myself hoping for Powdr's spectacular failure. I don't know if it will happen, but with all of this bad news, there really seems to be an "us vs. them" phenomenon developing. A recurring theme to the emails is a betrayal of loyalty. It's not pretty. I don't know what Powdr is thinking, but for their sake they better have an incredible year in 07-08 or otherwise, next summer, the proverbial sh*t is going to hit the fan.

anyway, there are a few more emails since HC's last post. I've omitted the author's names. What a disaster for that poor killington employee. She's inadvertently created a forum of all of last year's season pass holders in the childrens programs, and the anger seems unanimous. crazy. I really feel bad for her.

Hi All,
I am in the same boat with everyone else. Just wanted to suggest www.killingtonzone.com as a good forum for everyone to discuss this issue. We have been discussing it there since the announcement last week.
Thanks,

Come to Stowe! (<--In large type, bold -steve)

Last year our family had season passes at Killington and we spent the year comparing mountains and their offerings. I have 3 children - ages 4, 10 and 12. My 4 year old attended the Killington Ski school and was even allowed to snowboard since she loved it so much. I would give this program a thumbs up. But I certainly would not pay the rates they are now asking!!!

My daughters aged 10 and 12 were signed up at the ATC for skiing (12) and snowboarding (10). The skiing program was overcrowded and the instruction was just OK. The snowboard program at the ATC was HORRIBLE. The head coach Tyler was completely incompetent to coach the advanced riders. I mention this because, after the Ministars program, most children might want to advance to the ATC. If you think about the future, the Killington scenario is not pleasant.

In contrast, for $1300 a season, both my daughters age 10 and 12 entered programs at Stowe and we were REALLY impressed. My eldest (12) learned to Snowboard extremely well for one season and enjoyed it so much she wants to join the MMSC group (ATC equivalent). My 10 year old (an avid snowboarder) was coached by an extremely talented and dedicated team of riders. Mike Slaughter the head coach at MMSC coached her to become the USASA National Champion in her age for SL, GS, Slopestyle. She also won the silver in Halfpipe. Stowe didn't even have a pipe last year, so the team traveled to Okemo on a few occasions with the team. I know these achievements would have been impossible for her if she remained at Killington. MMSC also runs trips to France, Breck and New Zealand for the kids during the summer. These are completely optional.

We were hesitant about leaving Killington, a mountain we grew to love. However, we sold our ski home in Plymouth and headed 45 minutes further north for an experience well worth the extra distance. Stowe retains its small town charm even in the winter and has an amazing night life for families. Stowe has also committed to a killer park and pipe this season and I think the kids learned so much more here than if they remained at Killington.
You also can't beat Stowe's vibe.

If Killington expects to become Beaver Creek, management should think again. Anyone I know who wants to go ski/ride with the family for a week or more heads out West. The prices are comparable and the experience at Killington just can't compare. However, there are plenty of "weekend warrior" types who are willing to cash up every weekend or so. These are the people Killington should be embracing instead of turning away. If people are looking for an "elite" snow experience, they ARE NOT heading to Killington, and either are we.

If you are interested in the Stowe programs, a Mountain Buster Pass is still around $1300 for the season and includes lunch (just like the Killington program). It's for kids ages 4+. The daycare/ski program is about the same, I think. If you have kids who love to ski/ride though, I STRONGLY RECOMMEND the MMSC programs.

My entire family (12 adults 14 kids) goes to Beaver Creek every year and I can tell you the prices are MUCH more reasonable that Killington's. (Never mind the lift access, and terrain to be not even in the same solar system).
Furthermore I raced for Mt. Mansfield (Stowe) in high school and I can also attest to Stowe, Big Spruce, Little Spruce and Smugglers Notch "America's Family Resort" are all awesome.

The new owners at Killington appear to be trying to make up the cost of the purchase on those whom they feel they have over a barrel. Short sighted management will be their undoing.

Hello everyone,



In case we are looking to gain consensus on the increased prices, my wife and I were just as surprised and have pretty much the same situation – 2 kids (5 & 2), longtime season pass holders , condo at the mountain, etc…. Overall, I really have nothing but good things to say about our previous experiences with the kids programs and have no problem with “fair prices” even if that means paying a bit more this year which is what I fully expected. My son keeps raving about how he can’t wait to go back to Mini Stars. I fully expect an even better program this year especially with the maximum class sizes. However, like others, the cost to have our kids ski / daycare the number of days they did the last couple of years, even with the 35% discount, is hard to swallow and cannot be justified.



To add a different viewpoint, I was speaking with four families at soccer Saturday morning and a few others at a cookout Saturday night all of whom ski Killington a couple / few times a year and have had children in the kids programs. We were discussing the $130 / $180 per day prices and they all could not believe it and could not see themselves paying those prices. Most people recognize fair prices and make choices accordingly. It’s difficult to believe that vast majority vacationers and less frequent visitors will be less sensitive to these prices..



If a new strategic goal is to reduce crowding on the mountain from both loyal customers and infrequent visitors then maybe this is just the next step in a successful marketing plan. I’m sure the Killington Business community is supportive of fewer visitors to the region. Especially as other VT resorts still offer kids program season passes and 07/08 day prices well below K’s.

Hello Again to All,



Your responses are great and filled with interesting points. The new price structure is crippling. I urge you to share your opinions with the following folks from Killington. They need to hear from us. Maybe no one has told them yet?



Chris Nyberg cnyberg@killington.com President and General Manager of Killington

Joe Wood jwood@killington.com Killington Ski & Snowboard School Director

Tom Horrocks thorrocks@killington.com Killington Marketing





In fact, please cut, paste and resend your emails of today. It may be the only way to get some changes made. Please forward as necessary and cc them on all of our correspondences. I will be resending my original reply to Julie later as it is on my home computer.

this one puzzled me..

Looks like this pathetic new plan will be the first Official Killer of youth participation in winter sports.

Is there a parent on this email that wouldn't simply teach or share the experience with their child instead of using all your drinking money for Saturday at the Outback? OK, maybe I would utilize this service once over the winter, when I was deathly ill from the fun that just ended 2 hours ago.

[Killington Koyote]

Thanks for posting Steve, how's Rufus??, and Holy Crap a CAPTAIN Sighting!!!

[Powderputz]

I taught in the MiniStars and SuperStars programs for several years. Groups are SUPPOSED to be six per coach; I can tell you it often runs more. It is NOT easy trying to dress and manage six, seven, eight or nine little kids.

You don't want to know how little they pay instructors. It works out to about $8 per kid per day. Imagine---their labor cost for a group of six is $60; they collect over $700/day for each instructor (or more).

Powdr is about selling land; the mountain skiing experience is literally "ancillary". Powdr's multimillionnaire owners don't give a hoot about MOST Killington skiers. They want to revolutionize the mountain, and bring in big profits.

They'll soon learn it's not going to be easy. Once they complete their village, then what? Then it will be back to skiing as usual. And Powdr will try to bail out.

[Bubba]

This is classic!

Apparently the email that I quoted earlier had everyone's email addy in one big "To:" box. So now Killington has now just created a nice little e-mail list for people to bitch on. Nice work!

Are either of these people zoners?

We've had an influx of new registrants today as a result of this e-mail debacle.

[Ski-N-Sail]

I voted with my feet.

Hi All,
I am in the same boat with everyone else. Just wanted to suggest www.killingtonzone.com as a good forum for everyone to discuss this issue. We have been discussing it there since the announcement last week.
Thanks,

I sent this email to the ski school group today.

[millerm277]

Powdr is about selling land; the mountain skiing experience is literally "ancillary". Powdr's multimillionnaire owners don't give a hoot about MOST Killington skiers. They want to revolutionize the mountain, and bring in big profits.

Only problem is that there aren't a ton of rich people who are dumb enough to ignore all of K's flaws, and to not see how much better many of their competitors are in almost every category.

They'll soon learn it's not going to be easy.

I really hope they've realized that already...

[laseranimal]

I voted with my feet.

Hi All,
I am in the same boat with everyone else. Just wanted to suggest www.killingtonzone.com as a good forum for everyone to discuss this issue. We have been discussing it there since the announcement last week.
Thanks,

I sent this email to the ski school group today.

you want a finders fee for the new registrants?

[CAPBOY]

I taught in the MiniStars and SuperStars programs for several years. Groups are SUPPOSED to be six per coach; I can tell you it often runs more. It is NOT easy trying to dress and manage six, seven, eight or nine little kids.

You don't want to know how little they pay instructors. It works out to about $8 per kid per day. Imagine---their labor cost for a group of six is $60; they collect over $700/day for each instructor (or more).

Powdr is about selling land; the mountain skiing experience is literally "ancillary". Powdr's multimillionnaire owners don't give a hoot about MOST Killington skiers. They want to revolutionize the mountain, and bring in big profits.

They'll soon learn it's not going to be easy. Once they complete their village, then what? Then it will be back to skiing as usual. And Powdr will try to bail out.

I thought SP was the land partner???