Sunday 3/23/08 - Death slides on Lower Ovation!!!

[kerlandsen]

I skinned up C slope to ski A Slope on Saturday morning hoping that it had held some snow being in the lee of little Pico, or at least the trees held something. There was nothing but the same glare ice. It was a struggle to get down safely.

Once I got to the bottom I found a patrol that happened to be the same guy I had waved to on the way up and told him to take a look at it. He split on his sled to go close it, I assume. I Never did check on it again.

Same condition as Ovation, only no cat track

[Highway Star]

Isn't Ovation a double diamond? The conditions stated above should not have been an issue for skiers who the appropriate skills to handle a double diamond. The problem is all the Killington skiers who don't have a clue what they're doing and don't belong on trails with this rating.

Both men that I watched fall-slide seemed to be "advanced" level. Easily as good as some people here on K-zone. They just missed a manditory turn and veered into the ice. I'm guessing both of them have skied Ovation before.

I am fully in favor of Killington opening up challenging terrain and snow conditions.....and marking it as such. However, this is clearly an "unsafe situation".........like if they removed the ropes at the bottom of superstar...!!! Just asking for trouble.

You're putting people (advanced level skiers) in a manditory turn situation, with a hazard that might not even be apparent to some people. The ungroomed part of the trail had bamboo up a the top for a couple hundred feet, but the lower 3/4ths wasn't - people might have thought it was ok.

I see people over their heads all the time, and tons of poor skiing, but this was a clear case of mountain negligence.

[Geoff]

Personally, I stayed off lower Ovation last weekend. Superstar, Double Dipper, and OL were fine. There were a number of people out on race stock who were treating them as a Super G course. I'm lacking the equipment, technique, and testicles to ski that terrain at that kind of speed. I don't have that kind of edge grip skiing on 86mm-waist all mountain skis.

[Highway Star]

Personally, I stayed off lower Ovation last weekend. Superstar, Double Dipper, and OL were fine. There were a number of people out on race stock who were treating them as a Super G course. I'm lacking the equipment, technique, and testicles to ski that terrain at that kind of speed. I don't have that kind of edge grip skiing on 86mm-waist all mountain skis.

I hit around 70+ mph on Double Dipper.........

[buzzkill]

I think it was closed early on Sunday. I got over that way a little before
9, middle looked good, so I figured to hit that and then lower SS. While I
was going down Nivis walk I was bum rushed by a pack of four, I wondered why
they were in such a hurry, rope must've just dropped.
I got into the chase and followed them down Middle O in hot pursuit, they veered
onto Lower O and kept going, I stayed behind and just let the skis run. E ticket G forces,
what a rush, just enough crust to keep some steering turns going and enjoy the drop.

HS - were you blocking the trail playing junior sled dog? Get outta the way man, peeps got death sliding to do.

[Highway Star]

HS - were you blocking the trail playing junior sled dog? Get outta the way man, peeps got death sliding to do.

I was on the far edge of the groomed part, trying to help someone who was obviously in need of help...that's what expert skiers do. Plenty of people skied by without even a glance.

[Mister Moose]

I've never seen someone accellerate like that down the hill after they fell. Never. One second they're more or less traversing, the next second they're zooming down the hill on their backs. Each of those guys easily picked up 20+ mph of downhill speed after they fell.

The difference in friction available between what we think of as hardpack/cat track ice/blue ice/frozen hardpack and the shiny reflective slippery ice is considerable. The rate of acceleration is impressive and the terminal velocity is scary.


I agree, opening Ovation or any steeper trail only partially groomed where the ungroomed portion is glare ice is at best risky and at worst negligent. Someone falling, or "missing a mandatory turn" is a foreseeable event, ie likely to happen eventually.

I saw some ungroomed (I think it was on Superstar) sectioned off by bamboo poles set every 15 feet. Even this is risky, as if you get off balance, can't make the turn, and go beyond the groomed portion, you are doomed.

There should be a sign reminding skiers of the unusual and no fooling around level of danger that exists after an ice storm of that magnitude.

Isn't Ovation a double diamond? The conditions stated above should not have been an issue for skiers who the appropriate skills to handle a double diamond. The problem is all the Killington skiers who don't have a clue what they're doing and don't belong on trails with this rating.

Even double diamond skiers make mistakes. I don't think the penalty should be near certain injury as would be the case in this icy example.

I heard a group of younger intermediate type skiers talking about which trail to ski this weekend. Ovation came up, and the tone was let's try it! One said something like "I know I could get down it, but it wouldn't be pretty" I think it was closed by then anyway. What stood out for me was the phrase "I know I could get down it." I've heard this a lot, and it usually means "I have the stem christie and sideslip skills necessary to get me down a really steep hill, at least it's worked for me so far" There is no number of double or triple black diamonds that discourages this kind of thinking. Advanced trails are like merit badges to add to your collection. I guess that's why ski patrol closes trails we sometimes think we have the skills to ski. If there's ice around, I have no trouble with that. On powder days the ropes come down way too slow though.

I once as a kid was out playing on a hard crust, and we thought it would be fun to slide down to a pond on the crust. We knew we'd go fast, and it was safe because we'd just coast out to the pond and the entire length of the surface was very smooth. The whole area was a big cereal bowl. We didn't need a sled or anything. Zoom! We were down in an instant, and it was great fun. Let's do it again! Except we couldn't. The ice crust was hard enough that it didn't break underfoot, and after just a few careful steps up, you slipped and slid back down again. We were trapped. Felt stupid, too. Only after spending a lot of time kicking out each step for a long ways did we get out.

[SkiDork]

the moguls were the deadly part, not the groomed. I looked up at that and just cringed...

[ozzy]

i went down it once this afternoon. That was more than enough

[tyrolean_skier]

Anybody enjoy the grooming on lower-O this weekend?

They groomed HALF the trail!!!!

This would be fine except that the ungroomed half was super slick shiny glaze ice. Deadly.

We took one run down it. The groomed half was fine, with a couple spots of real bad ice. No big deal. Real nice on the far left from what I hear.

I was scoping out the ungroomed side, hoping for some spots with blown in pow.....no dice...80%+ blown off to glaze ice. I spotted a woman about 1/3rd down the pitch, out on the ungroomed ice....she had taken her skis off and was perched on a tiny spot of soft snow. I stopped and asked if I could help - she said she had been standing there for 15 minutes....had accidently skied over there when she missed her turn.

I was trying to help figure out how to get her off of there, when a guy about 100 feet above us veered into the ungroomed at about 30-35 mph.....he promply fell and lost his skis, and slid all the way to the bottom bouncing off ice bumps, head first. Probably a good 500+ ft, at least 30-40 mph. One of the scariest crashes/slides I've ever seen. The guy looked banged up, but he got up by himself after a minute. Standard advanced level skier.

At some point the woman dropped one of her skis. She then started working her way over very carefully. After about 5 minutes, death slider #2 shows up, and we get a repeat. His slide looked even more brutal, but he got right up and seemed to be fine. Again, 500+ ft at 30+ mph. He managed to shower us with spray and made the women drop the rest of her gear.

Two near misses....

Finally, after a few more minutes, she managed to work her way over.....and then what? I told her her best bet was to just slide down on the groomed, and try to stay in control. She went down facing the snow (not what I was thinking...duh) and was generally ok but got pulled over to the ungroomed at the end. Seemed to be alright. Not much else I could have done....?

Man, I wish I had video.....

Anyway, we get down to the bottom, and finally a ski patroller shows up on a snowmobile. We told him what just happened, and he said he had witnessed it from the base and came up. We suggested they close the trail until they can get it groomed. He said he would go talk to his boss.....trail stayed open the rest of the day, from what I could tell.

Seriously.....what the HECK are they thinking????

We have dual failures here - mountain ops for not grooming that half of the trail, and ski patrol not using proper judgement in opening the trail.

They are extremely lucky someone didn't get badly hurt or die.....

If you were talking about Saturday, they did close middle and lower Ovation shortly after opening it probably because of those slides. They did reopen it yesterday and I skied it twice, the second time the ice was showing through on the groomed side. I believe that today lower Ovation must have been closed because you could clearly see ice spots showing through on the groomed side and I didn't see anyone skiing it. I believe that middle Ovation must have been open because I did see people skiing down that. I never ventured over there today.

BTW, my friend and her son got taken down on OL this morning when an out of control slider took them both out on her way down OL. My friend and I were standing on the hill encouraging her son on making his way down when we heard screams from the lift telling us to watch out. We looked up the hill but the woman came crashing into my friend and took out her son afterwards. I had picked up her pole and took it down to her and told her that she should have made more of an effort to try to stop herself. She was not making any effort to stop and she only stopped when she reached almost the bottom. Luckily nobody was hurt badly and my friend's son's comment was "She took me for a ride".

[Coydog]

The skier's right (the glazed over bumped section) was marked off this afternoon.

Ovation should be a blast this spring once in softens up (assuming the season lasts that long).

[tyrolean_skier]

The skier's right (the glazed over bumped section) was marked off this afternoon.

Ovation should be a blast this spring once in softens up (assuming the season lasts that long).

Then it was open? It did not look invititing enough to me seeing all those icy sections in the sunlight.

[summitchallenger]

This would be fine except that the ungroomed half was super slick shiny glaze ice. Deadly.

Simple solution. Don't ski it.

[summitchallenger]

Personally, I stayed off lower Ovation last weekend. Superstar, Double Dipper, and OL were fine. There were a number of people out on race stock who were treating them as a Super G course. I'm lacking the equipment, technique, and testicles to ski that terrain at that kind of speed. I don't have that kind of edge grip skiing on 86mm-waist all mountain skis.

I hit around 70+ mph on Double Dipper.........

Riiiggghhhttt...

[rogman]

They had 3 Cats on Ovation early Saturday morning, one going right up lower. Didn't appear to be winching. As much as anything, I suspect there was a bit of "I bet we can groom this sucker" going on. Perhaps they were testing out that new Cat; couldn't tell. I'll give Killington credit for trying. Keep in mind it was Patrol that chose to open it; I think there would have been complaints if they hadn't.