The Trials Of Donald Trump

[deadheadskier]

Jenna Ellis now taking a plea deal.

I don't understand this. If this is all one big witch hunt like people such as Moose are saying, then why do all of these Trump associates keep pleading guilty? Why would innocent people do this?

[Bubba]

Jenna Ellis now taking a plea deal.

I don't understand this. If this is all one big witch hunt like people such as Moose are saying, then why do all of these Trump associates keep pleading guilty? Why would innocent people do this?

Four have pleaded guilty so far, with three of them being attorneys. I believe those three have all answered questions that are on videotape for future use in trials of others. Of course, they could all testify to Trump being guilty of shooting someone on Peachtree Street in downtown Atlanta and his supporters would still vote for him, rationalizing and justifying their vote on policy differences with Biden and the Democrats. Some people’s moral compasses need realignment.

[deadheadskier]

For sure. I've said it before, but my gripe with Trump supporters is not our differences in political philosophy, but in morality. The man belongs no where near an office of public service at best and probably belongs in jail at worst.

[G-smashed]

Let's go for worst. Fry the bastard.

[Heywood jablowmee]

Let's go for worst. Fry the bastard.

Such anger. Such unparalleled toxicity. Did the priests use you for target practice?…,inquiring minds wanna know!

[Mister Moose]

Jenna Ellis now taking a plea deal.

I don't understand this. If this is all one big witch hunt like people such as Moose are saying, then why do all of these Trump associates keep pleading guilty? Why would innocent people do this?

Show me where I said this.

[XtremeJibber2001]

Jenna Ellis now taking a plea deal.

I don't understand this. If this is all one big witch hunt like people such as Moose are saying, then why do all of these Trump associates keep pleading guilty? Why would innocent people do this?

Show me where I said this.

I don't think you did. I think DHS is probably generalizing based on prior comments you've made. For example, below (emphasis mine)

While there are certain liberal voters who will carry Democrat politicians water and claim witch hunts in regards to investigations; it isn't even close to what we see on the Republican side with the defense of Trump and his circle.

Go right ahead and investigate Clinton, Hunter, Joe, Kamala; investigate any of these politicians you want. If they did something wrong, throw them in jail.

Why is this so difficult for Republicans to do and say with Trump?

Oh right, party over country. FancyPants, Moose and others all running cover for Trump because it matters that badly to them that team red wins. They'll vote for a strait up traitor to the constitution.

For Chrissakes, stop putting words in my mouth. Can you EVER stop trolling? I run no cover for Trump. If he's investigated and found guilty, strip him of eligibility and or throw him in jail. However so far, all that's happened is a giant accusation in Russia-gate that turned out to be a partisan hoax, and 91 charges in however many indictments. It's silly. Just the number alone indicates desperation. Focus on the core charges. As I've always said, I'll wait for the process and the testimony.

Name me one other politician that was investigated by the FBI, was the indirect subject of a court order for surveillance on bogus contrived evidence, and was excoriated in the press for it, and it all fell apart as a hack job.

[deadheadskier]

Jenna Ellis now taking a plea deal.

I don't understand this. If this is all one big witch hunt like people such as Moose are saying, then why do all of these Trump associates keep pleading guilty? Why would innocent people do this?

Show me where I said this.

"Are you referring to Trump's 90 odd charges? Yes, I do see those as less concerning. Many are exceedingly thin. I'm least familiar with the Georgia indictments, so I'll let those chips fall further."

It was this one I was thinking of. So I guess I owe you an apology because you did state you weren't ready to opine on Georgia yet.

Now that four chips have fallen, what's your stance on Trump's post election activities in Georgia?

Witch hunt still?

[Mister Moose]

Jenna Ellis now taking a plea deal.

I don't understand this. If this is all one big witch hunt like people such as Moose are saying, then why do all of these Trump associates keep pleading guilty? Why would innocent people do this?

Show me where I said this.

"Are you referring to Trump's 90 odd charges? Yes, I do see those as less concerning. Many are exceedingly thin. I'm least familiar with the Georgia indictments, so I'll let those chips fall further."

It was this one I was thinking of. So I guess I owe you an apology because you did state you weren't ready to opine on Georgia yet.

Now that four chips have fallen, what's your stance on Trump's post election activities in Georgia?

Witch hunt still?

What I've heard so far (and I haven't been paying very close attention) is a few guilty pleas from some Trump associates. Part of their plea agreement is to testify against Trump. I don't see where the trial has concluded yet, or that we have heard Trump's defense. I think your comments are premature.

I have personally seen poor decisions by trial judges that were later turned over on appeal. So get ready for a comment from me that doesn't necessarily ascribe immediate alignment with some troubled lower court decision that gets appealed.

Here's what I said in 2016 from the wayback machine, with today's comments in red:
viewtopic.php?p=586613

This is the Dewey moment in our lifetime.


Not only that, with Republican control in Congress and the executive, there will be a pendulum swing in policy larger than we have seen in our lifetime, or at least since Carter > Reagan. This was borne out on tax cuts, defense, NATO, and trade deficits. Trump did not get along at all with Paul Ryan, (speaker) and there was adversarial relationship on many other issues.

I'm looking forward to a balancing of our foreign trade, but not going further to a protectionist tariff driven overcompensation. Trump took this as far as he could. COVID provided a serious awakening to the extent we are dependent on China for everything from surgical masks to pharmaceuticals to electronics.


I'm looking forward to a resurgence of capitalism without the cronyism. Of all Trumps scandals and foibles, skimming cash (DHS hotel obsession notwithstanding) was not one of them.

I'm looking forward to far less abuse of executive privilege. Not sure how I'd score this one without more research.

I'm looking forward to a greater emphasis on individual work, responsibility and achievement, and less emphasis on socialism. Done.

I'm looking forward to a health care policy that seeks to reduce costs more than it seeks to force equal misery at high cost to all of us. 10 minutes in your doctors office for a routine procedure using cheap everyday supplies shouldn't cost $600, shouldn't take 3 weeks to schedule, shouldn't consist of evasive insurance estimates, and shouldn't be charged by a secret price structure of overly complicated insurance contracts. Trump completely dropped the ball here.

I'm looking forward to an example where no one is above the law. Paradoxically, Trump might provide us the first example of this.

I'm looking forward to a Supreme Court that decides an application of the law, and doesn't twist, invent, or ignore the law. Trump's effect on the Supreme court looms large with 3 appointments.

I'm looking forward to an improved economy with improved unemployment and less deficit spending. Trump's pre COVID economy was excellent, and during COVID he spent large, contributing to record deficits. Trumps unemployment was excellent, and record breaking among minorities.

We'll see what we actually get. Trump's unpredictable sometimes impulsive decision making will no doubt cause some kitchen fires. There will be infighting with the press and the entrenched liberal established opposition. Trump is no angel of social morality nor capitalistic virtue. He sits on gold plated chairs. But in many ways he is the medicine for entrenched politicians and what that breeds when length of someone's political career drives the agenda more than the business of the people.

[deadheadskier]

Jenna Ellis now taking a plea deal.

I don't understand this. If this is all one big witch hunt like people such as Moose are saying, then why do all of these Trump associates keep pleading guilty? Why would innocent people do this?

Show me where I said this.

"Are you referring to Trump's 90 odd charges? Yes, I do see those as less concerning. Many are exceedingly thin. I'm least familiar with the Georgia indictments, so I'll let those chips fall further."

It was this one I was thinking of. So I guess I owe you an apology because you did state you weren't ready to opine on Georgia yet.

Now that four chips have fallen, what's your stance on Trump's post election activities in Georgia?

Witch hunt still?

What I've heard so far (and I haven't been paying very close attention) is a few guilty pleas from some Trump associates. Part of their plea agreement is to testify against Trump. I don't see where the trial has concluded yet, or that we have heard Trump's defense. I think your comments are premature.

I have personally seen poor decisions by trial judges that were later turned over on appeal. So get ready for a comment from me that doesn't necessarily ascribe immediate alignment with some troubled lower court decision that gets appealed.

Here's what I said in 2016 from the wayback machine, with today's comments in red:
viewtopic.php?p=586613

This is the Dewey moment in our lifetime.


Not only that, with Republican control in Congress and the executive, there will be a pendulum swing in policy larger than we have seen in our lifetime, or at least since Carter > Reagan. This was borne out on tax cuts, defense, NATO, and trade deficits. Trump did not get along at all with Paul Ryan, (speaker) and there was adversarial relationship on many other issues.

I'm looking forward to a balancing of our foreign trade, but not going further to a protectionist tariff driven overcompensation. Trump took this as far as he could. COVID provided a serious awakening to the extent we are dependent on China for everything from surgical masks to pharmaceuticals to electronics.


I'm looking forward to a resurgence of capitalism without the cronyism. Of all Trumps scandals and foibles, skimming cash (DHS hotel obsession notwithstanding) was not one of them.

I'm looking forward to far less abuse of executive privilege. Not sure how I'd score this one without more research.

I'm looking forward to a greater emphasis on individual work, responsibility and achievement, and less emphasis on socialism. Done.

I'm looking forward to a health care policy that seeks to reduce costs more than it seeks to force equal misery at high cost to all of us. 10 minutes in your doctors office for a routine procedure using cheap everyday supplies shouldn't cost $600, shouldn't take 3 weeks to schedule, shouldn't consist of evasive insurance estimates, and shouldn't be charged by a secret price structure of overly complicated insurance contracts. Trump completely dropped the ball here.

I'm looking forward to an example where no one is above the law. Paradoxically, Trump might provide us the first example of this.

I'm looking forward to a Supreme Court that decides an application of the law, and doesn't twist, invent, or ignore the law. Trump's effect on the Supreme court looms large with 3 appointments.

I'm looking forward to an improved economy with improved unemployment and less deficit spending. Trump's pre COVID economy was excellent, and during COVID he spent large, contributing to record deficits. Trumps unemployment was excellent, and record breaking among minorities.

We'll see what we actually get. Trump's unpredictable sometimes impulsive decision making will no doubt cause some kitchen fires. There will be infighting with the press and the entrenched liberal established opposition. Trump is no angel of social morality nor capitalistic virtue. He sits on gold plated chairs. But in many ways he is the medicine for entrenched politicians and what that breeds when length of someone's political career drives the agenda more than the business of the people.

Trump could have had the political achievements of Eisenhower, FDR and Lincoln combined and none of that matters in 2023. His behavior since the election is the most disqualifying of any US President to have lived. It has been 2 years and 9 months of his tiny middle finger facing our constitution.

And the fact that he wasn't disqualified is perhaps the greatest evidence yet that there is indeed a deep state. Only not the deep state Trump attacked and you believed in. They were working for him, not against him. It was Barr on Russia and Mitch on Russia , Ukraine and 1/6. And all of the other sackless traitors in the GOP.

[easyrider16]

Some of these Moose comments are downright laughable. You'd need to do more research before deciding whether Trump abused executive privilege? Let me help. Multiple times the Supreme Court packed with Trump appointees rejected his spurious claims of executive privilege.

Capitalism without cronyism? Seriously? I mean you cite one example of it right in your response with the hotel stuff. How about him holding court at mar a lago and boosting the membership price? FFS the guy put his own family members on his staff and they profited from it (Kushner and the Saudis, for one example).

As to "greater emphasis on individual work, responsibility and achievement, and less emphasis on socialism" I guess you can call it done if you overlook the massive amounts of government spending and giveaways he supported.

And crediting him for the economy and job numbers he inherited is pretty sophomoric.

[XtremeJibber2001]

We'll see what we actually get. Trump's unpredictable sometimes impulsive decision making will no doubt cause some kitchen fires. There will be infighting with the press and the entrenched liberal established opposition. Trump is no angel of social morality nor capitalistic virtue. He sits on gold plated chairs. But in many ways he is the medicine for entrenched politicians and what that breeds when length of someone's political career drives the agenda more than the business of the people.

Is a candidates morality or, respect for others humanity, play a role in your voting? If so, how much does it influence your decision making when it comes to the vote? Is it different for voting than it is in other areas of your life?

Sincerely interested. Not trying to troll you

[easyrider16]

The answer is usually some form of, yeah he's bad but he's better than the other guy and/or he's getting the job done.

I say you can't fight bad with more bad. Character should be the number one most important criteria of any elected leader. American voters have been putting other things before character for a long time and it's why we are where we are now.

[XtremeJibber2001]

Can we file this under 'trials' like trials and tribulations?

[XtremeJibber2001]

We'll see what we actually get. Trump's unpredictable sometimes impulsive decision making will no doubt cause some kitchen fires. There will be infighting with the press and the entrenched liberal established opposition. Trump is no angel of social morality nor capitalistic virtue. He sits on gold plated chairs. But in many ways he is the medicine for entrenched politicians and what that breeds when length of someone's political career drives the agenda more than the business of the people.

Is a candidates morality or, respect for others humanity, play a role in your voting? If so, how much does it influence your decision making when it comes to the vote? Is it different for voting than it is in other areas of your life?

Sincerely interested. Not trying to troll you

Moose - here's a brief clip from the late great David McCullough. In it, he references Dwight D. Eisenhower's 4 key qualities to measure a leader:

Character
Ability
Responsibility
Experience

Interesting Eisenhower listed Character first.

When I think of President's during my lifetime (Reagan, Bush, Clinton, GWB and Obama), prior to Trump, I don't think any of them failed all 4 qualities ... much less the first, character.

What say you?