poll: spring skiing on superstar or the canyon?

[skiadikt]

saw big bob ask the question in another thread and some of us were discussing the topic on the mtn today. now that we're over a week into "canyon" season, figured it's a good time to start a poll and get everyone's take.

enjoying the canyon. think the mtn has done a spectacular job and appreciate their effort. like leaving one run bumped and alternating the grooming on the other two. overall the skiing is more "demanding" but the "vibe" is missing. you just don't get the same party scene at the base that you do w the ubar and the access rd. also a lot of skiers who might normally ski a couple in the supe pod are done because there's no easier route in the canyon.

[Crippity]

i agree with your description. i was too late yesterday, while im on fine on all the terrain those massive bumps are just a bit too much for me. LEF was rough. y not have grill going just cooking burgers dogs and beer for sale at canyon?

[asher2789]

superstar has the vibe and friendlier terrain, canyon is technical and a nice break from the usual but i miss superstar. for personal reasons im actually kinda glad its canyon and not superstar this year... its harder for me to get jibby with it on steeps so the temptation is less when i shouldnt be riding in the first place due to injury. on superstar ill be spinning 1s and 3s from bump to bump, but on dipper the landing is too steep and you gain too much speed and i promised myself i would ride conservatively until my surgery....

[asher2789]

i agree with your description. i was too late yesterday, while im on fine on all the terrain those massive bumps are just a bit too much for me. LEF was rough. y not have grill going just cooking burgers dogs and beer for sale at canyon?

LEF despite being a single black IMO as a rider has been the hardest of the trails this spring. the lines are tight although well formed.

[Skid Mark]

The vibe is off because the weather has sucked the last 3 weekends

[Stormchaser]

The vibe is off because the weather has sucked the last 3 weekends

With more r*in Friday and Saturday...

[buckethead]

The vibe is off because the weather has sucked the last 3 weekends

With more r*in Friday and Saturday...

like some sort of cruel payback for (2) springs back - and last one too - where we got sun and supportive temps throughout may.
thank goodness for midweek ops extending into next week!

[skiadikt]

The vibe is off because the weather has sucked the last 3 weekends

With more r*in Friday and Saturday...

like some sort of cruel payback for (2) springs back - and last one too - where we got sun and supportive temps throughout may.
thank goodness for midweek ops extending into next week!

seems like it's been 5 straight weekends that have sucked starting w the ice storm last weekend march. bmmc not good. pond skim had ice. had to move daze & confused indoors. this past weekend eh. certainly have been windows of good skiing but overall the mtn has taken a big hit. on the other hand, we've had blue skies most weekdays the last 2 weeks. sorry to the weekenders ...

fwiw i'm surprised the results of the poll are so close. really thought supe by a large majority even if mostly for the vibe/party thing.

[Southside_Bobby]

Spring on Dipper is feeling the same as Supe, in that the chair is on the side of the trail, and everybody gets to see what an extremely bad bump skier I am.

Otherwise, comparing this Spring to a typical one on the Supe pod feels very apples to oranges.

The switch to all expert skiing has occurred way earlier than normal. If the weather had allowed them to keep GN going TTB through next week, or even if it allowed LEF to be a groomed-down route much of the time, it would feel more comparable to having Skye/Bitter open during this period. As it is, a lot of intermediate skiers, who would normally keep going, are now done for the year.

The vibe itself, without the Ubar and access rd partying right at the base of Supe, would not be the same even with the best possible weather.

The singular comparison - DD vs Supe - is one I find interesting. They are very different trails. Most of DD feels steeper than middle Supe, but I usually find both the headwall and Preston's to be more intimidating when bumped than I am finding DD TTB.

For me, the clear outstanding feature so far this spring has been LEF. And I say this as a poor bump skier. The bumps are huge, but spectacular. Way better than they often are on Supe. The snow is SO good. And I find the way the pitch continually gets easier, I feel better and better as I go down. As opposed to Supe, with the tougher top and bottom, and the easier middle.

[buckethead]

fwiw i'm surprised the results of the poll are so close. really thought supe by a large majority even if mostly for the vibe/party thing.

supe/access is world class.
looking forward to my first spring day in the canyon but as i said elsewhere: more like spring at the bush. the fun is up on the hill. no spectators or adjacent tailgate scene.

i remember the season that ended simultaneously on supe and DD. couldn't be in 2 places at once and i *believe* i got my last run or two on supe. just because.

[hillbangin]

For me, the clear outstanding feature so far this spring has been LEF. And I say this as a poor bump skier. The bumps are huge, but spectacular. Way better than they often are on Supe. The snow is SO good. And I find the way the pitch continually gets easier, I feel better and better as I go down. As opposed to Supe, with the tougher top and bottom, and the easier middle.

No Snowboarders? LEF is higher up so the snow should be better.

I spent a week in Alta this year - amazing how much better it skis than the Bird.............Same snow - only one difference. No offence to the Boarders on the Board.

[newpylong1]

Better terrain and more variety in Canyon. Could care less about the vibe, I come to ride. Weather has been awful on weekends so opinions may be skewed.

[BurrPondSkiTeam]

[/quote]

No Snowboarders? LEF is higher up so the snow should be better.

I spent a week in Alta this year - amazing how much better it skis than the Bird.............Same snow - only one difference. No offence to the Boarders on the Board.
[/quote]

This reminds me that perhaps 15, or 20, or 25 years ago the differences in the manner you describe between them were especially stark when considering how often snowboarders would wipe a bunch of snow out of narrowish chutes on their on boards at Snowbird, leaving a lot less coverage to be skied (or ridden) on... so there were much better conditions, at particular times, at Alta.

In recent years, there are places at Alta where skiers on bigger (fat) skis are doing much the same thing boarders once did only at Snowbird, unfortunately (simply, they are not carving enough; it's often more difficult given what they are using, no matter who they are or what they are on).

As well, the fat equipment also lends to skiers forming some of the same type of "not fun," sharper bumps snowboarders once only did in low angle terrain, which first became apparent to me during a ski day at MRG some 20 years ago in the springtime, when I had a flashback to skiing at Killington as a kid years earlier. The terrain was "cleaner," with fewer odd ripples around! "Why is this different and so much fun??"

(I say these things as a lifetime skier, though please realize I've been on boards. Admittedly, not much and not in decades. I had a roommate at one time with a global position at Burton and he got me out there on a carving setup one winter when I was injured and skiing was very uncomfortable [lumbar disc issues]. I did find there's nothing better than boards for certain conditions and I'm also thankful I experimented by riding and what it required of me with regard to body position/alignment... in that it helped me to alter my skiing technique enough that I had a breakthrough with hip countering, basically, which resulted in much easier carving, cleanly on both skis, back when "shape skis" were in their very infancy [prior to the turn of the century; no pun intended].)

[asher2789]

For me, the clear outstanding feature so far this spring has been LEF. And I say this as a poor bump skier. The bumps are huge, but spectacular. Way better than they often are on Supe. The snow is SO good. And I find the way the pitch continually gets easier, I feel better and better as I go down. As opposed to Supe, with the tougher top and bottom, and the easier middle.

No Snowboarders? LEF is higher up so the snow should be better.

I spent a week in Alta this year - amazing how much better it skis than the Bird.............Same snow - only one difference. No offence to the Boarders on the Board.

my friends and i ride east fall just fine. its very technical but the line is nice. but that self selects for the level of riders up here.... all have to be able to at least slip bumps.

[asher2789]

No Snowboarders? LEF is higher up so the snow should be better.

I spent a week in Alta this year - amazing how much better it skis than the Bird.............Same snow - only one difference. No offence to the Boarders on the Board.

This reminds me that perhaps 15, or 20, or 25 years ago the differences in the manner you describe between them were especially stark when considering how often snowboarders would wipe a bunch of snow out of narrowish chutes on their on boards at Snowbird, leaving a lot less coverage to be skied (or ridden) on... so there were much better conditions, at particular times, at Alta.

In recent years, there are places at Alta where skiers on bigger (fat) skis are doing much the same thing boarders once did only at Snowbird, unfortunately (simply, they are not carving enough; it's often more difficult given what they are using, no matter who they are or what they are on).

As well, the fat equipment also lends to skiers forming some of the same type of "not fun," sharper bumps snowboarders once only did in low angle terrain, which first became apparent to me during a ski day at MRG some 20 years ago in the springtime, when I had a flashback to skiing at Killington as a kid years earlier. The terrain was "cleaner," with fewer odd ripples around! "Why is this different and so much fun??"

(I say these things as a lifetime skier, though please realize I've been on boards. Admittedly, not much and not in decades. I had a roommate at one time with a global position at Burton and he got me out there on a carving setup one winter when I was injured and skiing was very uncomfortable [lumbar disc issues]. I did find there's nothing better than boards for certain conditions and I'm also thankful I experimented by riding and what it required of me with regard to body position/alignment... in that it helped me to alter my skiing technique enough that I had a breakthrough with hip countering, basically, which resulted in much easier carving, cleanly on both skis, back when "shape skis" were in their very infancy [prior to the turn of the century; no pun intended].)

i dont "carve" bumps unless the in between is ice/hardpack. im usually relatively flat based and almost doing a kick turn as one would on a skateboard in a halfpipe. the steeper the trail the bumps are on, the more effective it is as gravity is better manipulated so one is actually on their downhill edge before the next bump which on a flat would be an edge catch but somehow (gravity) it works on steeper bumps. an example would be the headwall of LEF... im a goofy footed rider (this matters because heel and toe turns are not equal), i come in from the right / steeper side of the headwall and then somewhat traverse across above the rocks doing a variation of whats called "pain in the S" turns where im doing an S in the traverse so my downhill edge (heels) is in the snow for speed control before i drop down, do a frontside turn as if in a halfpipe and then back to my toe edge. to do that section of LEF as a pure zipper line on a snowboard wouldnt really be possible, or it would be but not enjoyable, partly because theres rocks but also the fall line just isnt right for it, but as soon as i get to the lower entrance of east fall i can zipper line to the bottom if i want to with an occasional line correction.

east fall this spring kinda reminds me of a less steep OL.

edit - tried to find some youtube vids that explain it better but couldnt find a good one that explains the two things im doing at once. but heres one of them each, on skis and a board, that i do combined:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ngikfY0ofrM
^notice the skiers put their downhill edge in on the traverse of the slope

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V2oA3FKYbmM
^sucking up the knees and using the tail to control speed on a board